What'll it cost me?

[fiasco]

This is a follow-on question to my original post in the New Member section. ( http://fiatspider.com/f08/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=3838 )

The '81 that I was looking at on eBay was relisted, so I am thinking about it again (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayI ... 71621&rd=1). Based on the description, it sat for 16 years prior to this sale, and based on advice from my previous post I asked the seller if all the belts, hoses, fuel and brake lines have been replaced. The answer is that, other than the timing belt, none have been looked at.

So my question is, if I were to buy this car, what kind of cost am I looking at to replace all belts, hoses, fuel and brake lines either if I do it myself, or if I have it done for me. I know no one can give me an exact price, I'm just looking for ballpark from someone with more experience than myself. $200? $800? $2500?

Also, assuming the worst, what else should I plan on doing no matter what? Guibo (honestly, I'm not even sure what that is, just that everyone says to be sure it's not bad or it will fall apart while you are driving and the drive shaft will impale your car) or is that something that degrades with use, but not when sitting? Timing belt, radiator, water pump and thermostat are all supposedly new. Needs tires and a new top, though in SoCal, the top can probably wait.

Let me know what you guys think. With all the talk about the SoCal get together, I'm bummed that I don't actually have a car yet.

Thanks,
-- se

[kmead]

Have you driven the car yet? It is in town right? You could also negotiate buying it direct versus the whole Ebay thing.

I would budget around 500 bucks for maintenance items presuming you are going to do it yourself. (Tires will be beyond that).

I would replace all the hoses both cooling and fuel lines, the coolant, the brake fluid, the brake pads and likely the rotors. I would look carefully at the brake flexible lines. The guibo could wait as it looks good in the photo, just plan on it in the future, its a fussy job. Obviously the oil, oil filter, air filter and the fuel filter. Although they say they have replaced the timing belt, I would still look at it. I would also replace the transmission and differential oil with new.

Personally I like to start with knowing that everything is right and what has been done before I start driving it so that I know when to do the next maintenance.

[rlux4]

Steve, often, when any car sits that long the rings will rust and the engine would be siezed. The seller says it runs well, so if that's true they dodged a major bullet. I would ask if they'd allow you to do a compression test on it. This would only take a few minutes. A test drive would tell you a lot. Is the tranny OK? ($1200-1500 to rebuild), does the engine actually run well, do the brakes operate smoothly. If these components are good, the lines and rubber parts are not a major expense. Guibo (flex disc) is under $30, the center bearing and carrier is under $50, u-joints, under $20, Even the brake lines can be changed out to braided steel very reasonably. If it were me, I'd go for it. Even though it's not an '82.
Good luck,
Ron

[mbouse]

mileage matters not for a rubber part. sixteen years is sixteen years... that includes the timing belt.

i don't care if that was the last thing he did before storing the car (replace t-belt) .. it is past time to replace it again. the guibo may look good, but i would be inclined to inspect it after your first 300-500 miles, then make it part of your second phase restoration.

certainly the brake system needs a thorough go thru. it is not that expensive to replace all five hoses, and you need to replace the pads and 100% of the brake fluid anyway. pads that sat and collected moisture that long are certain to be mush. besides, why would you wanna jepordize your #1 safety system for a few pennies??

if it is rubber, it needs replaced. this car has sat too long with zero maintenance to make any wear item reliable.

[nicktheviking]

Keep in mind, and this is something I'm experiencing, that you may need to buy some tools that you don't have.

For instance, the oil drain plug is a 12mm hex. I had to buy a 12mm hex allen wrench, that was $8.50 right there.

There are a lot of hidden costs, so find a very conservative estimate and double it, then add $100.

[fiasco]

Thanks - that's great feedback.

For you California guys. Do I need to be concerned about smog? I know I will have to pass the smog check, and I have not gotten reassuring feedback from the seller that it will pass ("we will try" he said). I know that Cal law is that the seller is responsible for providing a valid cert., but if I end up with a non-passing car, and I still want it, what kinds of trouble, repairs, costs am I most likely in for.

My only past experience with this kind of thing was a 67 Mustang I bought a number of years ago before it had passed into exempt status. The seller paid off a tester to get the cert, and when I found out I was out $1500 for new heads (the heads with the appropriate ports for the smog equipment had been removed at some point). Got the BAR involved and the tester sent me a check for $750, but I could never track down the seller to extract my pound of flesh. Needless to say, I don't want to get involved in something like that again.

Thanks,
-- se

[So Cal Mark]

FI cars aren't a problem as long as the cat converter is working. Carbed cars are more difficult, but I prepare lots of them for the smog test and don't have too much trouble

[fiasco]

My wife (god bless her) keeps encouraging me to wait a bit and spend a little more to pick up a car that's a little further along the resto road. As usual, she's right, so I'm letting this one go (and the Craigslist project car in San Dimas that I looked at this morning). I'm going to hold off a couple of months and let some other things get settled (finishing up a couple of consulting jobs), and then restart the search at closer to the $5k - $6k shopping range.

Till then, I'll keep lurking and learning.

Thanks again!
-- se

[So Cal Mark]

Steve. check your private message box

[kmead]

Out of curiosity, did you check the car out? From the pics it looked unusually clean even for a California car. We all know that pics are deceiving thus the need to inspect the car.

Keep in mind that no matter what older car you buy, you will be doing something to it. The purchase price of a car is no guarantee of it being in fact a "better" car or one that will need less maintenance. A higher price generally suggests a car that looks better and may be in better mechanical condition, but not always.

In any case good luck with your search.

[baltobernie]

Hi Steve,

Did you do a search on this site for "restoration costs" and similar keywords? I'd also check out the online catalogs of the popular Fiat specialty parts suppliers, and make an imaginary order of the parts and tools you know you're going to need. As Mike says, if its rubber, it needs to be replaced. That includes tires, unless you can find a date code on them.

Fiat Spiders are a great source of pleasure and pride to their owners, but only if they're running safely and reliably.

[fiasco]

Out of curiosity, did you check the car out? From the pics it looked unusually clean even for a California car. We all know that pics are deceiving thus the need to inspect the car.

Yep - I went by and took a look, but couldn't drive it because the tires were shot. Not being able to drive it made me nervous because there was no way to get a feel for the condition of the trans. The car was not nearly as clean as it looked in the pics (as is common), but was reasonably good. I didn't see an rust in places I could get to (looked underneath, pulled up the carpet in front, looked in the trunk). It did start up and generally sounded fine - no really bizarre noises at least. Some PO had done some strange things to the dash pieces, including drilling holes in the glove box where there were a couple of bare LEDs that I assume were connected to an alarm. The center console had clearly been removed and poorly reinstalled.

Probably would have been a reasonable purchase at $2000. Ended up selling for $3177.

-- se

[rlux4]

It sounds to me like you're doing a good job of valueing a car Steve. I think though, that if you watch diligentely you should be able to find a really good one for a good deal less than $6000. Sometimes it's strange why one car will go for more than it's worth, while another will go for far less than it's worth.
Good luck.
Ron

[kristoj]

Your patience and discipline will ultimately pay off.

[CiscoKid]

I'd dig a bit deeper into my pockets and pick up that Aniversary special that Marl's friend has. Put the money upfront and avoid surprises later.