Mechanic's repair cost

[dbr]

Hello All,

So I took my spider down to a european specialist mechanic for a deep and thorough inspection. The following is what they found as well as their quoted repair price.

-Recommend timing belt service due to unknown service records Quoted:$1500
-Minor play front right wheel bearing - monitor Quoted $300
-Front ball joint boots cracked. Joints are tight. - monitor Quoted: $700
-Motor mounts oil soaked and collapsed Quoted: $1000
-Multiple engine and transmission oil leaks. Replace valve covers gaskets, pressure wash, add dye and inspect at a later date. Quoted: $500
-Rear driver brakes rotor disc needs replacement. Quoted: $600
-Crack on flex disc - Replace Quoted: $500
-Recommended Services: brake fluid, coolant flush, oil service, spark plugs, engine air filter Quoted: $610



Do these prices sound reasonable? I didn't think that they were all that hard to repair and cost of the parts doesn't come close to what they are asking. For example just for the engine air filter they wanted $70, I feel like I am forgetting something but a new filter is only $11, right? $59 in labor?

I am considering doing some of the work myself. Is there anything that would be recommended for a mechanic?

Thank you in advance!

[seabeelt]

A lot of those prices are plain ridiculous. Replacing the timing belt requires coolant replacement anyway. Timing belts are around $20. Water neck gasket $2 and around 2.5 hours to complete. So even at $140 hr that's less than $400 bucks. You can do it yourself for less than$30 with parts shipped to your door

If you don't have one already get a service manual.

These folks are wonderful for everything you need

http://www.autoricambi.us

[4uall]

Strongly urge you not to use them unless you enjoy burning $

+10 on AR and the forum is an incredible resource as well

[spider2081]

I think they are telling you they do not want to work on your car. Post your location here and ask for recommendation for mechanic or help to do the work yourself.

[azruss]

I am considering doing some of the work myself. Is there anything that would be recommended for a mechanic?

Mechanic prices can really vary depending on your location and the kind of shop you use. When I do mechanical work, i spend as much time cleaning as i do wrenching.
I had a friend who owned a Dino 246gts in Beverly Hills back in the early 70s. The local Ferrari dealership charged him $2500 for a tune-up.
If your mechanic is used to working on old Porsches, Mercedes and the like, i'm not surprised to see those numbers. when i had a bodyshop, i inflated prices by 30% for Porsche and Mercedes customers because they were such a PITA, i had to spend that much more time with them. It wasn't enough!
Many of us have learned to work on our cars just for the crazy amount of money you can save. There are many things i would not do myself, mainly from a cost vs knowledge trade off. I wont do my own valve work, but will pull the head. I put new bearings in my diff, but don't thing i would replace a ring gear or something with a chipped tooth as the alignment is quite critical. I will pull axles and replace axle bearings. I've rebuilt starters, but now would pull it out of the car and take it to an auto electric shop. Much of the labor on big items like an engine or tranny rebuild is in removing the entity from the car.

[narfire]

I think they are telling you they do not want to work on your car. Post your location here and ask for recommendation for mechanic or help to do the work yourself.

+1 here. They definitely do not want to work on your car. I see $5710.00 in quotes.... that is about $7423.00 in Canadian dollars and for that here you are purchasing a pretty nice car without issues.
I think he took a dart board to figure out the quote, no real logic to those quotes. By-pass that guy.
Working on these cars is not difficult for the most part. As mentioned a couple of manuals and help here and from a couple of vendors that contribute a great deal on this forum will give you the knowledge and confidence( not to mention the replacement parts required) to most repair evolutions on these cars. A set of decent metric tools is a must as well.
Chris

[bradartigue]

If you really want to part with that kind of cash I'll come to Chicago and do it myself. As noted, post the shop name so no one goes back there.

All of this except maybe the suspension work you should be able to do on your own, or know how to do it and find a competent mechanic...

I'd like to pick it apart though:

-Recommend timing belt service due to unknown service records Quoted:$1500 - takes about 3 hours and $100 in parts. Should be $400 or so for a quick/dirty job, maybe $600 to do it right and clean up the motor while at it, maybe replace the camshaft seals too.

-Minor play front right wheel bearing - monitor Quoted $300 - a one armed man could replace a wheel bearing on a Spider in about an hour.

-Front ball joint boots cracked. Joints are tight. - monitor Quoted: $700. If it includes all the rubber I could see this taking about 5 hours and $200 in parts, so this might be dead on. Suspension work sucks and you do the brakes at the same time, just to ensure complete misery for a day.

-Motor mounts oil soaked and collapsed Quoted: $1000 - holy crap, for a Spider? To replace the motor mounts you need a jack or hoist, one friend, and a case of beer. This is an hour of work for a drunk person and a stoned homeless man on the hoist control.

-Multiple engine and transmission oil leaks. Replace valve covers gaskets, pressure wash, add dye and inspect at a later date. Quoted: $500 - Add dye. Seriously? Add dye and inspect at a later date. Oh and pressure wash, because leaking seals love to be hit with high pressure water. He probably hits them cold, that way they're sure to split so he can charge $8,000 for an engine rebuild. By the way, don't ever, EVER add anything to your oil. Here we find evidence that your mechanic is an idiot. M O R O N A L E R T

-Rear driver brakes rotor disc needs replacement. Quoted: $600. A rotor is $18. This takes about 30 minutes. When done by the aforementioned drunk, homeless, stoned guy, it takes 48 minutes.

-Crack on flex disc - Replace Quoted: $500 - whats a flex disc? I use terms from the 1960s. If he is talking about the clutch then $500 for the clutch kit, transmission pull, etc., is actually a good price. Evidence he has no idea what he is getting into....he isn't going to be able to do it in the 2.5 hours he gave himself.

-Recommended Services: brake fluid, coolant flush, oil service, spark plugs, engine air filter Quoted: $610. He forgot to replace the muffler bearings and flex disc hydraulic fluid. By employing the use of gold spark plugs and hand spooling silk for the air filter, he arrived at $610.

[phaetn]

I was composing a reply on an iPhone while Brad was posting and he beat me to it. He knows far better than I, but I can comment on work that I had done locally.

Those quotes are insane prices. Some of them obviously include parts, but even so are nuts.

Your best bet may be to find a mech that is willing to do the work if you bring parts to him that you have sourced.

The timing belt alone is crazy. I didn't do that myself recently because I was running out of time, but I had the timing belt replaced, a new water pump installed with new tensioner bearing, the engine shampooed, all front seals replaced (this takes a fair amount of work because it requires removing the cam pulleys, and auxiliary and crankshaft pulleys); to boot, new cam cover gaskets were installed, and the oil and filter replaced for less than about CA$500 labour. This work requires the rad to be drained and removed, so it was also flushed and refilled. I supplied all parts, including fluids. The actual cost was a bit more because I also had him try to replace a seized and stripped bleeder nipple for the front left caliper that he heated a few times (no luck!) and he bled the brakes, plus checked for a noise I was worried about from the rear. All told less than CA$600 before tax just for labour. Call it another $200 or so for the parts (including a complete gasket and seal set, many parts of which will be used at a later date).

Seriously, to replace the cam cover gaskets (at least on my car where no throttle cable is attached) is about ten to fifteen minutes. It's just four bolts that don't even require the Allen key/ratchet head, just pliers. If you need to scrape off old gasket material add a bit more time. This may not solve the leak, but is super easy to do as long as you are not planing any surfaces. The reality is that no mechanic is going to charge you less than about .75 of an hour just because of the the time to bring your car in the bay, etc. This is the kind of super simple stuff that doesn't require any specialized tools and can save you a lot of $$.

As for the brake, as long as the caliper is in good shape, parts in the form of a rotor and pads shouldn't be more than about $40 -- they are generically available. Maybe 1.5 hours labour; it should probably take well less, but be prepared for more if things are seized as nothing is predictable with these cars. You can't get *anything* done for much less than an hour just because of hoist time unless it's some stock, very competitive process like rotating tires for a flat rate.

Shop around. Find someone who is competent and likes to work on old cars like Minis, Triumphs, MGs etc and that you can trust to give you accurate numbers for hours worked. If you see old Italian cars hanging around expect to pay more -- it's just the way it is... The Haynes manual also provides estimates for repair time for almost all components.

A modern shop will almost always cost you more, too, as they have to spend time figuring out what/how to repair, even if competent, just because of lack of familiarity. And old hand that knows the era of car and wants the work will probably charge a lower hourly rate AND take less time doing it.

Your very best bet? Get to know some local guys who know the cars and are willing to help you learn and wrench and probably already have the required tools. Spend a weekend doing it and supply beer and all parts. . If you really want the genuine Spider ownership experience then be prepared to get your hands really dirty and say goodbye to your loved ones for hours at a time as you go and do "just one more thing" on the car. It never runs out of more things..

Cheers and good luck,
phaetn

[spidernut]

YEE GHADS! That's totally insane for the repair costs. My additions to what has already been said:

Flex disc - I think he's talking about the flex joint (Guibo).
I agree on the suspension work - it is a pain and the price looks about right

Run away from this person - run as fast as you can - do not stop until you are as far away as possible, do not pass "Go", do not "Collect $200". From what is on this list, I know that I could repair everything listed in two weekends even taking my time to clean everything up. Most of these repairs are easy to do and require no special skills or talents...just patience, a good shop manual, some mechanics gloves and a few bandages.

Find a nearby Fiat friend who is willing to help. There are talented and generous individuals here in the Fiat community.

[KevAndAndi]

I am literally laughing out loud with eyes watering at Brad's responses.

The fun of these cars is working on them yourself, and they're only slightly more sophisticated than go-karts.

Wait a sec: dbr, weren't you in the process of selling the car?

[So Cal Mark]

those prices are way out of line unless their hourly rate is $500 or higher

[dbr]

Thanks for all the great responses.

It's too bad but I have run into the highest rated mechanics in the area and both either didn't repair what they said they would or way over charge me. I wanted to hold off on the names but for the sake of other Fiat owners who might be in the area I think I should include them.

RX Automotive in St.Charles, IL did an inspection of the Fiat and didn't spot my completely rusted battery ground. My fiat also died and wouldn't start right when pulling into my house after picking it up.

Autobahn mechanics in St.Charles, IL seemed to do a good inspection and communication skills were great but they were the ones that quoted me with the above super high prices.

This takes about 30 minutes. When done by the aforementioned drunk, homeless, stoned guy, it takes 48 minutes.

bradartique you had me also roaring with laughter. Thanks for detailed info.

Wait a sec: dbr, weren't you in the process of selling the car?

Yes, KevAndAndi, I am selling it. I thought I needed a car for this winter and didn't wanted to subject the spider to it. But some things have changed and I have been able to find transportation for those winter months. So basically I no longer NEED a car this winter and so would like to keep my fiat but if it sells then.... I am actually hoping that it doesn't sell so I can keep it through the winter and mabe something will come up like a bonk around car. Who knows....

But in the mean time I will tackle the inspection list myself and look around for any other fiat guys in the area. I am actually looking forward to the work, fun and grease!!

Thanks again to all the answers and to the great forum!!

[joelittel]

Dbr, if you can get your car to Chicago I highly recommend AutoSprint or Willow Automotive.

Both shops are reasonable and knowledgeable of FIATs.

Also check out the Chicago FLU chapter. Many members with lots of good advice.

http://www.meetup.com/chicagolandfiatandlancia/

[pluktv]

Ha ha. Just be grateful you`re not a woman! This is a few years old now.

"June Spears, who was taken for a £6,322 ride by her local garage.

The largest bill for fictitious work carried out on a woman's car by garage mechanics was one of £6,322.88 charged by Joskin Bros Motors Ltd. of Stevenage, Herts. (GB). Calling in for a routine service on her one-year-old Peugeot 305, Mrs. June Spears agreed to pay for, amongst other things, new trumpets (£725), cracked gangle pin (£1,785), realignment of main glib shaft (£2,268), new grommets (£112), set of hexagonal tag nuts and dangleberry adapter (£35) and new piss-take valves (£120). No work was actually carried out on the car during the six weeks that it spent at the garage but 4000 miles were put on the clock and she later received a speeding summons from Italian police."

Not sure the above is entirely true.

[4uall]

my lady does all her own work

just sometimes hard to get into those tight spaces