Ideas of taking my motor to the next level

[ClarkTheShark]

As i am new to this forum ill introduce myself. My name is Jay Clark and i live in Tuscaloosa, Alabama. I am finishing my last semester in the fall in mechanical engineer at UA. My uncle and I are huge Fiat nuts. we have about a dozen including two anniversary editions.

Two weeks ago my car lost oil pressure due to the bolts on the oil filter housing backing out (giant leak)... the oil warning light was burnt out and i had no idea my motor was being destroyed. I stopped the car once i heard rod #2 banging around. This gave me an excellent excuse to put the motor back together with a little more gusto. The motor is currently running megasquirt MS2 v3.0 with edis ignition. ive done all the headwork Guy Croft describes as far as larger valves, porting, polishing etc... its a 2.0 liter with an 1800 head. I have headers and 2.25" pipes to the back. I lightened and balanced the crank, rods and flywheel. So basically, now that my motor is able to breathe properly, and im waiting for my crank to come back for the machine shop, i was wondering what the next step is. turbo?, cams?, HC pistons? im just at a loss as to what direction i should take this thing. any advice would be awesome.

Thanks, Jay.

[ClarkTheShark]

[So Cal Mark]

how will the car be used? projected rpm range? Stock rods?

[ClarkTheShark]

well this is sort of my project "racecar." i have an 84 pinin that is my street car. although i wish to drive this one on the street as well.... just much faster, if you know what i mean. the car has stock rods. i just grinded some unnecessary weight off of them as described by Guy. before it ran out of oil the motor had no problems running at 7 or even higher... but i dont want to run it quite that high all the time. possibly good power from 3.5 to 6.5 krpm would be more suitable.

[Zmatt]

sounds liek you know your way around an engine block. Since you already have megasquirt and edis why not make easy power and go force fed? There aren't many turbo/supercharger builds, but the custom ones are very impressive. Just my .02 Turbos means you don't need super high octane gas and you still retain the street-ability.

[engineerted]

I think the first question is: How much do you have to spend? Open pocket book? Or just cutting back on the beer fund to help pay for these upgrades? I think most of us just cut back on the beer fund.

I would go HC pistons ~ 11to 1 big cams and set it up to run on E85. It will make great power between 4-7k, not a great street car but a fun car!

Ted

[Zmatt]

How viable is E85 outside of race applications? Over here there is maybe one E85 pump in the entire city and I don't know how long it will be there. Seems like you would seriously have to plan your driving, but then again if this is not his normal fiat that may not be an issue.

[ClarkTheShark]

I really don't like the idea of e85 because there's only ONE gas station that sells it around town. i am a poor college student for the most part and i would say i have about a 700 dollar budget for upgrades. i like the idea of a turbo but where do i find an exhaust manifold? can i make one myself? i have a few flanges from some headers that could work... i dont have alot of money in the motor now... just a ton of man hours porting and polishing. But megasquirt is an excellent management system so i think a turbocharger would be pretty slick. so while i have my head apart should i put some mild cams in there? or does a turbo run fine with stock cams? i dont really care about a "lumpy idle". ive put a lot of work in this thing and i want it to produce.

[Zmatt]

You can pull most of the equipment you need of a junkyard volvo/audi/saab/etc. You can make a turbo header out of a stock on, basically you cut the down pipe and weld on the flange from one of the above turbo cars. you will need to make your own pipe from the turbo to the exhaust line. This is a cheap way to do it, but its a stopgap measure at best. I wouldn't do this on anything but a lemons racer or a turbo car waiting for a header. Mark Allison is working on a fiat turbo header as we speak, I think it will fit garret T3s, they are common turbos and can be found on a lot of junkyard cars. Get his header once it's released and you are good to go. If I were you I would get a smaller T3 that spins up fast, this will give you more power down low and help off the line acceleration, good for street driving. Megasquirt has built in boost management if i remember so you should be set on the electronics side.

[ClarkTheShark]

yes the new software has built in everything, including boost control.. yea ill be interested in what mark has to offer. i cant attest to how well his regular headers he makes perform... but if they work half as good as they look then they're awesome... so ill go junkyard diving for a turbo... so i need a garrett t3 to be specific. i suppose i can rebuild it if it needs it. and i need a manifold. and ill figure out the duct work myself.

[Zmatt]

the piping is the easy bit. also don't forget an intercooler, adding one increases your output a lot without increasing boost. it also raises reliability. reading off of what the turbo spider guys have done i don't think you need to beef up the fuel delivery if you go for low boost (8psi).

http://users.chartertn.net/jseabolt/80spider.htm

this guy has a working yet archaic turbo setup. it's basically a modified legend turbo kit. The megasquirt gives you a big advantage.

[ClarkTheShark]

my car also has an innovate LC-1 wideband 02 sensor. which might be the coolest thing ever. i never have worry about an improper mixture.. my spark angle is the only grey area. i really haven't found anyone that has some good base timing maps to go off of. i either need to take it to a dyno or figure out a knock sensor for it.

[Zmatt]

can you not retrofit a knock sensor from another vehicle?

[ClarkTheShark]

megasquirt isnt the problem... i can make a knock sensor from a model 1922 battleship work.... from what i've read, a knock sensor has to be mounted in ideal spot to really "hear" the knocking. i don't know enough about it but thats something to think about before i turbo this puppy. also, standard head gasket or should i go ahead and get a better one? guy in birmingham sells copper ones to fit my car. that might be overkill though... still trying to get bang for the buck. (hopefully not too much bang)

[boxdogracing]

I would suggest a 2L head to get static compression ratio down. Porting and polishing is optional in my opinion as boost can easily make up for the lack of it. I'am unfamiliar with Megasquirt, but have heard only good things. You will need to retard ignition timing in reference to boost. Stock cams should work fine, or at least try to keep valve overlap to a minimum.

My 83 spider will be my second car to turbo (first with EFI). I just ordered a bare header flange to start exhaust fabrication from:

Kirk Racing Products
1112 Hodges Drive
Mount Olive, AL 35117

Phone:
205-608-1156
205-608-1441 (fax)