restoring interior flooring

[nickc]

Hi everyone; well I finally own (again) a Fiat Spider, so I guess I am official now.
Naturally, the first thing to do with these cars is to rip up the carpeting and see all the beautiful reddish brown colored flooring (rust) that's underneath. I did just that and now I have a couple of questions for you guys on the best way to restore the interior, especially the flooring. So far, I have taken everything out of the interior floor. On the driver's side, I scraped up the layer of rubber that was glued to the floor; on the passenger side and the rear, I have left the rubber. All of ther exposed rust has been wire brushed down to almost bare metal. Next, I applied 2 coats of rust converter ($20 bottle) to all of the rust areas on the whole floor. Now, I am ready to restore. I have two goals: rust prevention and sund deadning (in that order). Since this is a fairly rare car (turbo, 48k original, documented mileage, one owner car, originally from the midwest), I would like to perform a complete restoration on it. Unfortunatelly, I do not have unlimited funds, however, so I humbly come to the Forum for advise.

1. Should I unplug (or pop a hole) in the water drain plugs to allow any futher water to drain? Road noise?

2. What should I use to paint the now exposed bare metal and rust converted areas? Someone suggested undercoating; would rather not spray .. What about regular Rustoleum Oil based metal spray?

3. Should I replace the glued rubber pieces? will humidity get in between the rubber and the metal, even though they will be glued together?

4. The car still had all of the original carpet "padding" (with the rubberized top); however, it was all wet. I have dried it all out, but is it a good idea to put it back (mold, etc), or should I replace it? With what?

5. Have seen/heard about the Dynamat product. Is this any good? There are a few different versions (Dynamat, Dynaliner, Dynapad, etc); which is best?

6. the original carpeting is in decent shape and will probably come clean with a good washing; however, I since I plan on a total retoration, I was thinking on purchasing new carpeting.
a. What are you feelings about a car restored with brand new (original matching) carpeting vs. a cer restored with the original, almost new looking, original carpeting? Does the original carpeting make any difference in the value of the car, in your opinion?
b. What company makes a decent carpenting set?

Thanks in advance for your help with this project,
Nick

[baltobernie]

Hello Nick, and Welcome. I'll be up your way next weekend for the 5 Boro bike ride; I hope the weather improves!

At the risk of being a smart-ass, you won't have to worry about interior rust if you store the car indoors and drive it mostly on sunny days! But seriously, if this is a daily driver, you've got to take more agressive action than the rest of us (including an oil pan skid plate for the BQE )

1. Drains should be clear for the inevitable water entry due to storms, etc. Make sure you seal any non-factory holes made by PO's for their audio installations, etc. My local auto-body supply shop sold me a caulking tube of "Dynatron #550", which I'm very happy with. It expands slightly when drying to a hard finish which can be painted. Has a little "give" even when cured.

2. I would go with truck bedliner over sound primer'd, POR-15, or rust-converted metal. All the OEM jute padding must first be removed, obviously, which you should do anyway, as the stuff is probably rock-hard by now and does nothing but trap moisture. I've seen bedliner done on driving cars; just mask off the area under the dash, etc. Not as messy as it sounds, and the stuff is friggin' bulletproof when dry.

3. Over the bedliner, I'd recommend http://www.yourautotrim.com/thercarpad.html which was recommended here by Danno. It is light weight, easy to mould to the tight corners, and provides noticeable heat reduction. Tack it down every eight inches with a dot of spray upholstery adhesive, available from the same vendor.

4. If the original carpet and pad can be cleaned, I'd resuse them. You may need to examine and adjust the placement of the Thermozite padding in tight-fitting areas, such as where the carpet meets the kick panels, console, gas pedal etc. The total thickness may be too much.

5. Dynamat products are expensive, IMHO, and are of little benefit on an old roadster. There's so much buzz (Good Buzz!) coming thru the steering wheel, seats and transmission tunnel that I think Dynamat is a waste of money.

6. Generally, I'd say that anything good original is better than anything new reproduction.

[htchevyii]

After wire wheeling and cleaning with Metal-ready I painted mine with master series anti rust paint, then gave them a coat of this rubbery anti rust coating, (Toyota Echos had a recall to prevent floor pan rust and we had some left over). Then I added some insulation, I got (Sound Destroyer?) on Ebay much cheaper that Dynamat.

[katsi]

Wow, that's a pretty nice job done there to the red one. Anyway, I stripped out ALL the rubber or whatever coating on the interior pans and found a LOT OF RUST WHERE THINGS WERE LOOKING WELL PROTECTED. I would strongly suggest stripping EVERYTHING down to metal B4 doing anything else just based on the fact that I found a lot of potential areas of major rust and stopped them. Then I just cut out the bad metal and welded in new peices here and there. Nothing great or pretty. I used a lot of metal angle brackets from Home Depot where the floor pans had rusted away from the sides and some welding metal patches from ACE (spent about 25 bucks on misc metal peices). I can hear the laughing now. But, they worked great and you can tweak them a bit to custom fit where you need them. After that, I hit it with some really thick rustoleim primer and then inserted some self made alluminum floor pans over Frankenstein looking stuff sreewed them down and went underneith and cut the screws to fit. Looks great and I plan to undercoat everything with bed liner.

[FiatColombia1]

I removed the original rubber stuff...anyway it was cracked on some areas and too soft on other. After I welded seat brackets to mount Miata seats, I use seam sealer from 3M, sanded the floor, spray some primer and then use the spray-on Raptor epoxy-bed liner. I've seen good and bad reviews on this bed liner... but as far as my experience it went on pretty easy, very straight forward process I was expecting more mess but it was pretty easy. you can't see it in my pics. but the texture is nice. 4 bottles comes in the kit, I used 3 did the trunk and the cowl area (remove the rubber from them also). the result: the floor seem to be more solid. I'm sure will help insulate heat and sound and protect from rust. I was researching and found several options to go like dynamat kind, simple paint etc.. but those were only helping a single issue, I think the bed liner will help with with all of them.

I still will use Thermozite as carpet pad. but I think I like so much this bed-liner that I think I'll plan on spraying the underside and wheel wells with this. I really like the results. (some people might say they doubt this will stop rust to form between metal and bed liner, but I think if you prepare your floors well a spray-on bed liner is one of the best options).

I'm my country the service stations used to offer a very common service in which they used to clean the underside really well and apply some kind of petroleum derivate to protect them from water I think it was a once year thing. just a remembrance.

[nickc]

Thanks to all who responded to my post!
Regarding the bedliner; does that smell when it gets hot out?
I am afraid that with a bedliner or an undercoating on a surface that has already started to rust, rust will continue to grow underneath and I will never see it. Has anyone seen this happen?

[baltobernie]

Once the bedliner cures, it is hard as a rock, and is unaffected by temperature. It is not like undercoating, which is made to "heal" from road debris with a controlled amount of movement over its lifetime. That's why I recommend bedliner for topside (or inside), and undercoating for underneath; two different environments.

If you've done a good job removing rust and preparing the surface, the proper coating will not allow rust to form under it.

[Darsella1]

I had a low mile Ltd. Edition that was very, very dirty when I got it. I ended up keeping the original corn row loop carpets as you cannot replace them exactly like the original. I wasted money on all kinds of products until I found Griots garage "interior cleaner": http://www.griotsgarage.com/

Use it straight on dry & soak it for a bit and then scrub with a brush. It's like something out of a infomercial. Then use a sweater shaver (buy at a craft store for $8) to get out the fuzzies. It will look like new! Yes, I would take out the nasty carpet liner- you can buy some simple 1/2- 1"" foam also at craft store for really cheap.

Here was my serious project from last year:

http://s251.photobucket.com/albums/gg28 ... ilsize.jpg

with Dynapad (you can see how high I went up on the engine wall):

http://s251.photobucket.com/albums/gg28 ... ilsize.jpg

I used POR 15 just on the front half of the floor since the back half was perfect. I did choose to go the Dynamat route as I wanted the floor really clean & sealed. As far as a sound barrier? Who knows. I'm not sure it can be done when you have a convertible. The Dynamat products are totally confusing. The silver stuff is Dynamat extreme, which is what most people use. On my other car I used an older Dynamat product that IAP used to sell. I did cover the drain holes but I marked with a marker a black X where they were. I'm not sure I would use Dynapad again as it was expensive and all it really was is foam with plastic over it.

You can buy it for much, much less on Amazon.com: http://www.amazon.com/Dynamat-10455-Xtr ... 339&sr=8-1

It's $139 with free shipping for 9 sheets (more than enough- you'll have a bunch left over) vs. on line or at a store is about $500.

So, your total estimated cost (keeping the original carpets) will be about $200 (including everything).

[kmac33]

Nick,
For my floor pan restoration I actually had to weld in some repair panels, but would have done the same "finishing" process if I had found just surface rust. I am pleased with the results and fairly confident I won't have floor pan rust issues for a number of years.
I removed all of the factory rubberized coating. Removed all of the rust possible, used a rust converter solution on the entire floor. Welded in the repair panels. Painted the areas that had had rust with Correless Rust Encapsulator (a great product you can get from Eastwood). For the rear areas that required repair panels (where water tends to accumulate if the interior gets wet) I put down a thin layer of fiberglass. I then coated the entire interior floor area with truck bedliner. The rest of the car may rust away in the next few years - but the floor pans should now be solid. I then put down "Hush Mat" to cover the firewall and the floor pans. This product is essentially identicle to Dynamat but significantly cheaper. It provides heat as well as sound insulation. I then put down a new carpet set. If you look around you can find carpet sets that are decent quality that do not cost that much - mine was around $190.00 from Bayless and although not the thickest loop or highest quality it looks great, and I topped it off with really high quality floor mats (they take all of the abuse). I also scrapped off all of the outside undercoating removed any rust, coated with rust encapsulator and sprayed on new undercoating.

[dantye]

I have purchased the pad you note in #3 of your post. The restorer who got did the brakes and got my 81 spider running says I should install this pad with the foil side DOWN for maximum heat insulation, but most photos I see show it with foil side up. What is your take on this, or is either option OK?

Thanks for any replies.

Hello Nick, and Welcome. I'll be up your way next weekend for the 5 Boro bike ride; I hope the weather improves!

At the risk of being a smart-ass, you won't have to worry about interior rust if you store the car indoors and drive it mostly on sunny days! But seriously, if this is a daily driver, you've got to take more agressive action than the rest of us (including an oil pan skid plate for the BQE )

1. Drains should be clear for the inevitable water entry due to storms, etc. Make sure you seal any non-factory holes made by PO's for their audio installations, etc. My local auto-body supply shop sold me a caulking tube of "Dynatron #550", which I'm very happy with. It expands slightly when drying to a hard finish which can be painted. Has a little "give" even when cured.

2. I would go with truck bedliner over sound primer'd, POR-15, or rust-converted metal. All the OEM jute padding must first be removed, obviously, which you should do anyway, as the stuff is probably rock-hard by now and does nothing but trap moisture. I've seen bedliner done on driving cars; just mask off the area under the dash, etc. Not as messy as it sounds, and the stuff is friggin' bulletproof when dry.

3. Over the bedliner, I'd recommend http://www.yourautotrim.com/thercarpad.html which was recommended here by Danno. It is light weight, easy to mould to the tight corners, and provides noticeable heat reduction. Tack it down every eight inches with a dot of spray upholstery adhesive, available from the same vendor.

4. If the original carpet and pad can be cleaned, I'd resuse them. You may need to examine and adjust the placement of the Thermozite padding in tight-fitting areas, such as where the carpet meets the kick panels, console, gas pedal etc. The total thickness may be too much.

5. Dynamat products are expensive, IMHO, and are of little benefit on an old roadster. There's so much buzz (Good Buzz!) coming thru the steering wheel, seats and transmission tunnel that I think Dynamat is a waste of money.

6. Generally, I'd say that anything good original is better than anything new reproduction.

[baltobernie]

The instructions provided with Thermozite (and repeated in the text of the Web link) state that the foil side should be Down when applied to floor pans. Dynamat and similar products install with the foil side Up.

[htchevyii]

The stuff I used was "peel & stick". The adhesive was on the non foiled side

[dantye]

Thanks! I bought mine from the same web site - I should have noticed the instructions there. Perhaps the difference is that the thinner, rubber types of mats that are better at sound deadening seem to go foil side up, but this stuff is a polyester "felt" with lots of air space for heat insulation, so, as with house insulation, the foil goes toward the heat to reflect the radiant component of the heat. Having the foil down also keeps it from trapping any moisture that gets in the pad by letting it evaporate.

The instructions provided with Thermozite (and repeated in the text of the Web link) state that the foil side should be Down when applied to floor pans. Dynamat and similar products install with the foil side Up.

[thechadzone]

I've been meaning to inspect the floor pans of my "new" BC Coupe, and this thread was the impetus I needed. I've already been impressed by how rust-free this car is, and I'm even more so now. There was no significant rust in the floor pans I've never seen a Fiat with less rust than this one.

The waffle patterned padding was also in excellent shape, and since it's a Coupe, it was actually dry! I carefully pulled it up and set it aside. The tar coating on the driver's side is perfectly intact, showing no signs of wear. The tar coating on the passenger's side was coming off, and I found some surface rust on the panel in front of the passenger's floor board, but it was only superficial. The carpet is faded and somewhat worn, but I'm going to try to restore it with a good cleaning and carpet dye.

[url=http://www.flickr.com/photos/thech ... .jpg[/img]
Fiat Coupe Floor Pans 9 by thechadzone, on Flickr[/url]

The pic below is the driver's side foot well:

[url=http://www.flickr.com/photos/thech ... .jpg[/img]
fiat coupe floor pans 1 by thechadzone, on Flickr[/url]

The pic below is the passenger's side foot well:

[url=http://www.flickr.com/photos/thech ... .jpg[/img]
fiat coupe floor pans 2 by thechadzone, on Flickr[/url]

[url=http://www.flickr.com/photos/thech ... .jpg[/img]
fiat coupe floor pans 7 by thechadzone, on Flickr[/url]

[url=http://www.flickr.com/photos/thech ... .jpg[/img]
fiat coupe floor pans 5 by thechadzone, on Flickr[/url]

[dantye]

Yes, coupes are obviously less likely to be exposed to the elements. From your pictures, though, I would recommend you look at a product called T-9, available from the Rust Store in Madison, WI. It is a spray that includes both a WD-40 type water dispersant oil AND a Ziebart-type wax. it comes with a tube that allows you to spray it into the seat rail supports (take an ice pick to these areas from underneath - may require removing cat converter and heat shield if present), frame members and other blind locations to help stop rust there. The biggest risks are the ones you cannot see. Would love to see exterior pictures of your coupe - what year is it?

I am still looking for detail photos of correct way to install carpet around the cable bundle that runs along the driver side door threshold, if anyone can point me to them. Seems to me that running the floor padding up to this bundle would help prevent or reduce a "bump".

[quote="thechadzone"]I've been meaning to inspect the floor pans of my "new" BC Coupe, and this thread was the impetus I needed. I've already been impressed by how rust-free this car is, and I'm even more so now. There was no significant rust in the floor pans I've never seen a Fiat with less rust than this one.

The waffle patterned padding was also in excellent shape, and since it's a Coupe, it was actually dry! I carefully pulled it up and set it aside. The tar coating on the driver's side is perfectly intact, showing no signs of wear. The tar coating on the passenger's side was coming off, and I found some surface rust on the panel in front of the passenger's floor board, but it was only superficial. The carpet is faded and somewhat worn, but I'm going to try to restore it with a good cleaning and carpet dye. .....