Things slowly falling into place.

[Zmatt]

It turns out my parts car is a 2 liter. The engine looks sound and aside form a rebuild should be fine. I understand that a common 2.0L mod is to mount an 1800 head on the block. I happen to have just such a head, with a port and polish. The 2.0L also looks to have a 4-2-1 header on it. Given some TLC looks like it could be a decent upgrade over the stock motor. What other upgrades do you think would work for such a setup? Say $1500 over a year or two to get the motor running and shaped up what would you guys recommend? This wouldn't be an all out build (if the budget didn't tell you that) but a hot street build.

[baltobernie]

Carb or FI? If carb, obtain a single-plane intake and get a new 32/36 Weber. Get a set of adjustable cam gears, and have your cam timing set exactly to factory specs; this can be done at the same time as valve adjustment. Have your distributor recurved using centrifugal advance only. Assuming all other components are up to snuff, you'll have a great all-around motor. If you have any money left over, buy a set of 40/80 cams. Use one on the intake; sell the other one to another builder; they are interchangeable on the intake side. You don't have much choice in exhaust systems; I had a local muffler shop make me a exhaust pipe from the stock twin downtube back to a low-restriction muffler. No cat, of course.

For FI motor, contact Mark.

[narfire]

As above.. AND.. shave a few pounds off the flywheel.. still have loot left over,perhaps $150 or so, have the rotating stuff balanced. Smooth the engine out and would spool up a bit quicker.
Of course you would be replacing the piston rings,main and rod bearings,seals gaskets as well. honing the cylinders, perhaps have the block boiled/cleaned.
Have fun, I just tore down a 1800 yesterday.

[So Cal Mark]

I'll go along with the suggestions, but I'd add in a high perf exhaust system with no back pressure. A well-designed system will work wonders. If you've been following the development of my new system for the X1/9, you'll see we obtained a 20% increase in torque and a 15% hp increase just by adding our header and exhaust system with no other changes

[ventura ace]

Mark, I missed the thread about the X1/9 exhaust system development, and related testing. Would you help me find it? Title? Approximate date? Or better yet, a link? I tried finding it with the Search feature, but didn't come up with anything. Thanks!

Alvon

[So Cal Mark]

it's on X web, not this forum.

http://xwebforums.org/showthread.php?t=7785

http://xwebforums.org/showthread.php?t=8419

[brunorahl]

If you rebuild the motor, use the piston's from Vick's. They are about 1 point higher compression than stock. It will be the biggest single improvement you can make. I recently drove a a car with a fresh 2.0 with 1800 head from them. It was quite impressive even with all the factory emissions and junk carb.

Don't be silly with your cams. Run the set if you get them. A single cam upgrade is nice, but it's silly to open the intake but restrict the exhaust.

Do things right the first time so you don't spend twice the money to correct it later.

[narfire]

$1500 for a re-build.. as mentioned price out the gaskets,rings and bearings,tensoiner bearing. 1800 head.. about $100 and then some more to surface and valves with new seals.Boil/clean the block and head..$50-75? Shaved flywheel and balancing.. perhaps $250. While the engine is out,how's the clutch? Change?.. $2-$250. headers are nice but carefull there, there are sets with varying degrees of quality, from Marks ceramic coated, to thin walled only welded on the outside(has gaps on the inside where the pipes join the flange). 32/36 carb new.. think about $350-400, single plane manifold.. I dunno, I paid $75 cdn for my last one.
I don't think you'll have much change left from the above, but will have a sportier engine, I believe several here have done these mods,including Mike Bouse, and have loved them.
If you are using electric fuel pump,pull the aux shaft and cut the lobe off the end and re-plug the oilway.
Then there could be the units of installation fluid,
Fun project over a few months

[Zmatt]

Should have mentioned I already have a 32adfa and 2 waffle manifolds. Cool ideas guys. The motor is not seized up, although a rebuild is a very good idea. so in order of things to do.

rebuild
adjustable cam gears and reset cams
recuve dizzy
lighten flywheel
exhaust system
Cams
hi comp pistons

$1500 for a re-build.. as mentioned price out the gaskets,rings and bearings,tensoiner bearing. 1800 head.. about $100 and then some more to surface and valves with new seals.Boil/clean the block and head..$50-75? Shaved flywheel and balancing.. perhaps $250. While the engine is out,how's the clutch? Change?.. $2-$250. headers are nice but carefull there, there are sets with varying degrees of quality, from Marks ceramic coated, to thin walled only welded on the outside(has gaps on the inside where the pipes join the flange). 32/36 carb new.. think about $350-400, single plane manifold.. I dunno, I paid $75 cdn for my last one.
I don't think you'll have much change left from the above, but will have a sportier engine, I believe several here have done these mods,including Mike Bouse, and have loved them.
If you are using electric fuel pump,pull the aux shaft and cut the lobe off the end and re-plug the oilway.
Then there could be the units of installation fluid,
Fun project over a few months

woah, ok. clutch is new. I already have 2 complete 1800 engines and a complete 2000, all FI they are form a 74 77 and 79 respectively. I know one has a 32adfa haven't gotten around to checking the other 2 yet....The 2.0L has the fiat 4-2-1 header already on it, the other two have the regular 4-1 header. The car doesn't have a cat or smog equipment (kentucky is awesome). And the drivetrain has just been rebuilt so no worries there.

Right now I am going ahead with plopping the working 1800 bone stock motor into the car and driving. I have the other 1800 and 2000 as starting points to build a better motor. This allows me to take my sweet time and do it right. It's also worth noting that the 1800 head that I intend to use has a port and polish, so i font know how that would affect the order and power increase these mods have.

[brunorahl]

Be sure to run an electronic ignition with your distributor. Be it an altered stock unit or one of the Crane conversions.

You should be aware, when setting the cams with the adjustable cam gears, Fiat gave no factory settings for the 124 or 132 series motors. Just here are some marks, good luck. And since you plan to be running 40/80 Pitatori cams that so many people offer, your best bet is to ask experienced racers what they recommend for cam timing. They are known as a "square" grind and can therefore be set to zero advance or retard with very little trouble, but the belts are a mix of rubber and high-tensile fibers. The resistance on the cam lobes by the valves will slow them in relation to the crank. You'll need to make an educated guess as to what a good advance will be to compensate.

[Zmatt]

Be sure to run an electronic ignition with your distributor. Be it an altered stock unit or one of the Crane conversions.

You should be aware, when setting the cams with the adjustable cam gears, Fiat gave no factory settings for the 124 or 132 series motors. Just here are some marks, good luck. And since you plan to be running 40/80 Pitatori cams that so many people offer, your best bet is to ask experienced racers what they recommend for cam timing. They are known as a "square" grind and can therefore be set to zero advance or retard with very little trouble, but the belts are a mix of rubber and high-tensile fibers. The resistance on the cam lobes by the valves will slow them in relation to the crank. You'll need to make an educated guess as to what a good advance will be to compensate.

Thanks for the advice. I don't have any experience on working on engines, in fact most of what i know about cars I have learned during this restore.

Another idea, I have seem some people hook up megasquirt units to the L-jet FI in the 2L spiders. How good of a setup is that and how difficult is it? I don't want to step form the land of asking legit questions and into the area of making the old guys roll their eyes at impossible projects but, would a megasquirt setup on such an engine be worthwhile/do-able? I'm sure it would make things 10000000% more reliable and would probably help smooth out that hockey stick torque curve and give me a better performing engine.

[So Cal Mark]

if you intend to use 40/80 cams with the stock FI you will have to use a megasquirt or something comparable. The stock FI will not run well with those cams, especially if you try to use a stock exhaust system. Unless you have the ability to degree your cams when you build the engine, save the expense of adjustable gears. IMHO, 40/80 cams are not a good choice for most owners for street use.

[Zmatt]

if you intend to use 40/80 cams with the stock FI you will have to use a megasquirt or something comparable. The stock FI will not run well with those cams, especially if you try to use a stock exhaust system. Unless you have the ability to degree your cams when you build the engine, save the expense of adjustable gears. IMHO, 40/80 cams are not a good choice for most owners for street use.

ok, what would you recommend then? I have a lot of parts sitting in my lap as is so I am not closed to other options most of the cost having already been taken care of (could you believe this 2L parts car was given to me for free?) I just heard about using megasquirt with fiats, sounds like a cool way to update the whole package, but then again i just found out you guys were using it today.