Making my '74 a good daily driver

[FiatRunner]

I did my headlights in about 2hours including coffee. The vendors sell kits that are almost plug and play. If you want to make your own and are comfortable soldering wires together you can do it for about 1/2 the cost, but that may not be worth it if you dont have those skills comfortably developed.

I'll look into it. I rewired my whole boat last summer, and that was a major pain, but I was able to learn the in's and out's of resolving electrical issues.

One question, do the running lights draw as much as the headlights? I often drive with the running lights on, so the taillights will be lit, but I would assume that there is less load than the headlights.

I am also looking into swapping the radiator fan for a newer one, that would hopefully draw less power. Has anyone on here put a newer fan on the stock radiator?

[18Fiatsandcounting]

One question, do the running lights draw as much as the headlights?

No, but there are more of them. The headlights are usually each 50 watts (4 amps) for the high beams and about 40W for the low beams (3.5 amps). Since you can't have both high and low beams on at the same time*, the maximum would be about 8 amps for both. The front and rear parking (running) lights are 5 watts each, and the front and rear side marker lamps are 3 watts, so that would be about 32 watts for all 8 lamps, or 2.5 amps or so.

* One exception: Early spiders will flash the low beams if you pull the stalk lever towards you, so if you were already on the high beams, both high and low would be running as long as the lever was pulled. Later spiders flashed the high beams, but you get the same effect if you were already on the low beams.

I am also looking into swapping the radiator fan for a newer one, that would hopefully draw less power. Has anyone on here put a newer fan on the stock radiator?

I haven't, but the early fan motors were the single biggest electrical draw in the car (other than the starter), and some were up to almost 10 amps. A modern fan will be more efficient and the only trick is figuring out how to mount it. Please don't tell me you're going to mount it with zip ties through the radiator...

-Bryan

[FiatRunner]

the maximum would be about 8 amps for both. The front and rear parking (running) lights are 5 watts each, and the front and rear side marker lamps are 3 watts, so that would be about 32 watts for all 8 lamps, or 2.5 amps or so.

Okay. I am much less concerned with the running lights, but I'll keep it in mind. 2.5 amps doesn't make me nearly as weary as 8 does. I'll put the light relays on the "things to do once I have a lot of time" list.

Please don't tell me you're going to mount it with zip ties through the radiator...

And don't worry, doing things the "right way" is one of my favorite parts of working on my car... I have done plenty of band-aid fixes on other vehicles, and I try to do things the best I can for my Fiat. I wouldn't mount a new fan without a dedicated shroud/bracket. But I am seriously considering a modern fan. I can definitely tell how much load it puts on the engine and alternator, especially at idle.

[Nut124]

I have an aftermarket fan in mine. I think it mounts on a factory radiator but mine is aluminum.

I think it came from AR or Vicks.

[FiatRunner]

I have an aftermarket fan in mine. I think it mounts on a factory radiator but mine is aluminum.

I think it came from AR or Vicks.

Would you recommend an aluminum radiator? They sure look nice, and I'm sure they perform well, but the full price for a radiator and fan would be close to $500, and I really can't justify that unless there is a very significant increase in cooling capability.

I also haven't driven the car in temperatures above 70 or 75 degrees, so it might also be smart to wait until the summer and then see if it's worth it or not.

[18Fiatsandcounting]

I also haven't driven the car in temperatures above 70 or 75 degrees, so it might also be smart to wait until the summer and then see if it's worth it or not.

I agree. I know the stories about how spiders often overheat, but if the stock system is performing as it should, there shouldn't be any problems. High performance engines would be a different story of course. And, if you like the "coolness" factor of an aluminum radiator, there's a reason right there.

-Bryan

[Yadkin]

Sorry for the delay I got called to my weekend early.

Here's a diagram to add the relays.


I've used this to do Hella ECE conversions on several cars. The self resetting breakers (SRB) are sized for the brightest 80/100W bulbs that Hella sells for these. Power them directly from the battery. The kit below has lower wattage bulbs, so size the breakers and wiring accordingly. Use 18 ga wire minimum size, for 20 amp 16, for 30 amps use 14.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hla-002395801

For relays: https://www.amazon.com/Pack-EPAuto-Rela ... B072QXDZRD

For SRBs: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07WLMB9B2

[FiatRunner]

I've used this to do Hella ECE conversions on several cars. The self resetting breakers (SRB) are sized for the brightest 80/100W bulbs that Hella sells for these. Power them directly from the battery. The kit below has lower wattage bulbs, so size the breakers and wiring accordingly. Use 18 ga wire minimum size, for 20 amp 16, for 30 amps use 14.

I will definitely look in to this some more. It seems that you've got it down to a science!

I actually got caught in the snow this weekend, in the Fiat. In the afternoon, it was 42 degrees and sunny, so I decided to take out the car and go to dinner with some friends. I went to dinner, and from where I was sitting, I couldn't see what the weather was like outside. After dinner, I went outside, and there was snow on the ground! In 2 hours, the temperature dropped almost 20 degrees, and I was almost an hour from home. I made it home fine, and before the salt trucks got out, but cursing myself the entire time for not checking the weather. It was not a fun time on my 250 treadwear summer tires.

At that moment, I could definitely see the need for better headlights.

[FiatRunner]

I've thought of yet another thing to add to the list of stuff to do.

Short shifter.

I've seen a few threads on the shorter extension, but does this actually work? I would like to have shorter lever throws, but if the shift knob is considerably shorter, I'm not sure how much I would like it. A friend of mine has a Miata, and he shortened the shift lever, but it made the shifter feel really short (in height), and really far from the steering wheel. I'm worried about that happening. Does anyone have experience with a shorter lever extension? Are they worth the $60?

[18Fiatsandcounting]

Does anyone have experience with a shorter lever extension? Are they worth the $60?

I may be an oddball (for many reasons), but I prefer the longer shift levers. I can't exactly say why, other than it seems like the shorter ones involve more effort to get it into gear. If you transmission is in top shape and shifts very smoothly, the short shifter may be great, but if you have any bit of "hesitation" in the gearbox itself, you'll notice it more with the short shifter.

As for it being worth $60? That's your call, but I always look at it in terms of what else needs fixing/replacing.

-Bryan

[FiatRunner]

I may be an oddball (for many reasons), but I prefer the longer shift levers. I can't exactly say why, other than it seems like the shorter ones involve more effort to get it into gear. If you transmission is in top shape and shifts very smoothly, the short shifter may be great, but if you have any bit of "hesitation" in the gearbox itself, you'll notice it more with the short shifter.

I'll definitely keep this in mind. I wan't to make sure that I don't try to make my car something it isn't. Sure, I could put on super grippy tires, stiff springs, hard bushings, and lots of power, but that isn't going to make it fun to drive on the street. To me, that's not what these cars are about. The last thing I want to do is spend money and make my car worse to drive.

Also, I have noticed that it sometimes requires a bit of force to get into 1st gear. I'm going to change the transmission oil once it warms up a bit, and I'm also going to remove the pan and replace the gasket. (which seeps oil more than I'd like it to) I'll take a look inside when I have the pan off, and see what the condition of the inside looks like. I'm hoping that a bunch of new, high quality oil will make it shift a bit smoother. I don't want to turn this into an oil thread, but I was thinking of using Redline MT90.

[18Fiatsandcounting]

I'm hoping that a bunch of new, high quality oil will make it shift a bit smoother.

It might. The original spec was a 90 weight mineral oil-based formulation known as GL-1. Some NAPA auto stores sell this by the gallon, or you can order it online. Don't use EP (Extreme Pressure) oils as those are hard on the brass synchros in the Fiats. EP oil is used in the differential and the steering box.

Some "notchiness" is, well, normal on the spiders. It's not a Honda Civic 5-speed. People have tried all sorts of different oils, some with good results, although I don't have much experience here as I've always just used GL-1 or the equivalent.

-Bryan

[FiatRunner]

Update: I have gotten nothing done.

Well, I have continued to grow my pile of new parts, but that's about it. Still too cold in Chicago to get any work done.

I've also added things to the to-do list, one of them being a fuel pump rebuild. The pump seems to work fine, but the check valve inside doesn't. Or so I'm told. I remember reading somewhere that there is a check valve inside of the pump that prevents fuel from draining out of the float bowl. This would make sense with my car, as it starts right up if it's been sitting for less than an hour, but any longer and it takes plenty of cranking to start.

Is this true? Are the pumps rebuildable? Does this check valve even exist?

Just wondering. It’s not a big deal if it isn’t fixable, the car always starts, it just requires a few seconds of cranking sometimes.

[18Fiatsandcounting]

There is a check-valve of sorts in the fuel pump, but it doesn't do anything to keep the float bowl from draining. The pump's check valve is just so that it pumps fuel towards the pump output connection rather than back towards the input. That being said, there may be some models of fuel pumps that have a one-way check valve in them to keep gas from slowly draining back down the lines towards the tank. I've never seen one in the pumps I've had.

The float bowl should keep fuel in it for about a week, maybe longer depending on climate. The loss there is from slow evaporation.

If you car is hard to start after sitting for an hour, the problem is not with the fuel pump or the float bowl. It's usually because the car is either slightly flooded or there's not enough gas in the intake manifold to fire. In other words, too rich or too lean.

Try two things to see which it might be:
1. Hold the gas pedal to the floor while you crank the engine. Don't pump it, just hold the throttle all the way open. If it starts more readily, the problem was that it was slightly flooded.

2. If #1 doesn't do anything, pump the gas a few times, let it sit for 10 or 20 seconds, give it a few more pumps, then try to start. If it starts more readily, it was starved for gas and you just shot some more gas in there with the accelerator pump and allowed it to volatilize for a bit. Gas vapors ignite easier than raw gas.

-Bryan

[FiatRunner]

If you car is hard to start after sitting for an hour, the problem is not with the fuel pump or the float bowl. It's usually because the car is either slightly flooded or there's not enough gas in the intake manifold to fire. In other words, too rich or too lean.

I’ll try out what you suggested. If it makes any difference, the pump I’m referring to is the stock mechanical one, and I have a high torque starter so it spins plenty fast.

The car always starts up with less than 5 or 6 seconds of cranking, unless it’s been sitting for upwards of two weeks or it’s very cold outside. Once it’s been warmed up, and sitting for less than an hour, all I have to do is bump the key.

I’m really not sure how well the carb is tuned but it’s always run well and pulled strong, but I guess mixture still isn’t out of the question.

I should get a chance to investigate the starting stuff in the next few days… I was really hoping to install the new steering linkage this week, but more than 15” of snow is expected tomorrow. Not exactly ideal Fiat conditions!

So we’ll see. Thanks for the help!