Automatic Transmission Mount Bracket

[FLGordie]

Hoping someone could give me information on the proper bolting location for the transmission mounting bracket for a 1980 Fiat 124 spider with Automatic Transmission.

There are two bolts under the car. The previous owner made modifications by adding a 1 1/2" spacer to lower the bracket and bolted to rear bolts.

Not 100% sure of the issues the previous owner was solving, but my guess is that the cross member/rail connection point rust repair has changed the clearance of the oil pan to the crossmember and underbody by the transmission is slightly crushed up due to improper jacking positions causing the transmission to interfere with the underbody.

By adding the spacer on the transmission mount, The transmssion is pushed down and the engine is pivoted up and provides clearance to both thee oil pan/crossmember and transmission/underbody.

It appears that if I can use the front set of bolts then the whole engine transmission would foward by 1" and also provide clearance to the oil pan/crossmember.

Right now, I have added spacers to the motor mounts to raise the engine and will try reconnect the transmission with the spacer and see if the car is driveable.

I am looking to understand how it left the factory so as I continue with restoring the car I know where I am heading.

I have looked at a lot of pictures and read many threads, but I have not found my answer. Thanks for the help in advance.

Pictures.. try copying the link into another tab.

https://1drv.ms/u/s!AkwV6N5dhf2Cg4lQSvI ... g?e=Muu2bb

[wetminkey]

Mine is a '79 with auto, but I'd bet it's the same. I can look/get a pic,...I can't remember the exact configuration, off hand.
To clarify, are you asking about transmission bracket bolt hole locations on the crossmember?
Todd.

[FLGordie]

Yes, exactly. I need to learn again to post pictures of my situation.

Thanks for the help.

Copy Link into another tab.

https://1drv.ms/u/s!AkwV6N5dhf2Cg4lQSvI ... g?e=Muu2bb

[wetminkey]

Wow! I can sure get some pics, but it looks like you've got extensions on your crossmember to frame bolts that lower the entire rear of the tranny. I'll bet that's what you have a problem with,...
And I see that your last pic concerns exactly that,...
Let me see if I can get some pics of the crossmember to frame attachment and tranny to crossmember attachment.
BTW, pics have to be "hosted' by another website, and proper links copy/pasted to view them here,...I use Imgur. It's free.
Pics soon. Todd.

[wetminkey]

Well. I was unable to get some pics today. Perhaps tomorrow,...I'm sorry.
But I took a good look and compared what I have to your pics.
Dude, your mount is weird! The upper flange of my mount extends toward the front, and that is where the bolts enter the tranny,...yours extends rearward.
Just below that, I see that my (smaller) horizontal bolts are inserted toward the front (and your's could use some nuts, I think).
Concerning the crossmember, I could swear that mine is symetrical, side to side, and your's looks like it is not. Is it the proper crossmember for the car?
My crossmember bolts are also inserted towards the front (Oh, of course, due to the oil pan. Probably same reason for the upper, smaller horizontal bolts), so that from the rear, all I see is bolt heads for all of the connectors,...nuts to the front.
I hope this makes sense, and helps.
I'll see if I've got enough light to get pics tomorrow.

[wetminkey]

Well, I MADE enough light,...and got a pretty good pic.
This will help you will understand what I was trying to describe yesterday,...

I sure hope that this will help you return you Spider to a more factory-like condition!
Todd Compton.

[FLGordie]

This is very helpful.. This is what I have learned about my car from studying the picture of your car.

1) PO used an early model transmission mount bracket which had the exhaust running down the center of the car without a catalytic convertor, thus the mount being curved toward the passenger side.

2) the PO has the bracket facing backwards which moves the engine and transmission back towards the rear by about 1/2"

3) the undercarriage is crushed up by about 1" due to poor jacking locations over the past year, thus using the scabbed in spacers.

I think I will rotate the bracket 180 degrees and try to move the engine/transmission forward by the 1/2", so that oil pan will have more clearance. I will have to continue to use the spacers due to the crushed undercarriage.

I welcome more input from the forum. The issue is clearance of the oil pan to the cross member, which is tied to the repair where the crossmember attaches to the frame and location and tilt of the transmission.

[wetminkey]

That explains a lot,...I'm glad that the pics and description helped! I see how little room you have between the pan and the crossmember from your pics! Very best of luck with alterations, FLGordie!
Todd.

[FLGordie]

Question:

Is the CS2 cross member a direct fit into the CS1 frame. if so, I can swap them out and solve oil pan hitting the cross member issue?

Back story:

I am reasonably sure the frame is from a 1978 CS1 and the engine and automatic transmission are from 1980, which would cause the interference at the cross member and the need for spacers at the transmission mount.

The tell tale signs are that the frame is the 1978 CS1 frame and not the 1980 CS2.
the frame vin number has been ground off,
the trunk lock is positioned high on the rear of the car,
inside the trunk you can see holes where the 1600 name plate mounting holes came through,
the was hood support bracket mounting holes are towards the driver side and not centered on the frame,
the engine bay has a bracket on the passenger fender wall that held the emissions air pump valve.

My car vin numbers match as follows:
the engine compartment plate shows 1980 CS2 frame.
the driver door vin plate shows 1980 CS2 frame,
the engine block is the 132C3040 1995cc engine block.

I believe the engine and transmission and vin plates where put on this 1978 CS1 frame along with the doors, hood, and interior.

But the cross member is for a CS1 frame and is not meant for the larger engine.

Is there a another location where the vin number being stamped on the frame?

[DieselSpider]

So you have a 1978 on which some newer parts were swapped over into and then the real vin number was obscured and a fraudulent one was affixed.

Sounds like bigger problems than just a cobbled up transmission mount. In many if not most places someone grinding off the main VIN stamped on the frame could be facing some time behind bars. Title is based on the frame and not the engine or other accessories bolted to it.

[FLGordie]

Another possibility is that the 78 frame is salvage and the 80 original frame was damaged. So the title and parts were moved from 80 to the salvaged frame.

The question at hand is are cross members from CS1 to CS2 direct replacements? What are the ways to determine if the cross member on the car is for CS1? Would a CS2 cross member help with the clearance issue at the oil pan?

[DieselSpider]

Another possibility is that the 78 frame is salvage and the 80 original frame was damaged. So the title and parts were moved from 80 to the salvaged frame.

The question at hand is are cross members from CS1 to CS2 direct replacements? What are the ways to determine if the cross member on the car is for CS1? Would a CS2 cross member help with the clearance issue at the oil pan?

The car would still be a 1978 since it was the one that was salvaged using the parts from the 1980.

AFAIK the car should have been titled as the 1978 frame and main body that it was built on with the 1978 VIN and not as the 1980 that the doner parts came from making so that you do not have the title to the car and leaving it so that the last owner of record for that 1978 car can claim it as their property. What your describing is considered a Felony in most places I have lived.

For the secondary issue of a poor swap over being done you will likely need to verify that the engine cross member and transmission bracket are correct as the transmission support bracket is longer on the standard transmission compared to the automatic and the engine cross member sits the engine lower to compensate for the taller engine used from 1979 to 1985.

1979 to 1985 automatic transmission mount:


1979 to 1985 manual transmission mount:


1968 to 1978 manual transmission mount: