'74 Electric Fuel Pump recommendations

[squealingtires]

I'm replacing a pulse style, trunk-mounted electric fuel pump on a 1974 124 Spider. Normally this pump behaves well, but this past weekend with the soaring temperatures (100deg), the pump rhythm slowed down and the engine was not getting enough fuel to do anything more than idle. I noticed the pump's coil housing was very warm when it was acting up. I took it apart and everything looked clean. Interesting pump as there is an electric coil surounding a plunger rod. the rod is attached to a diaphram at the top and with some one-way valves fuel is moved from the "in" to the "out" Anyways, what replacement pump is recommended?

[baltobernie]

I've had good luck with the Facet "cube" pump. I think our usual vendors sell them. The rubber isolators I see in your photo may fit the Facet hole pattern; if not, you can get them separately ... they do keep the pump quiet.

Couple things: First, make sure it's the pump that's faulty, and not a plugged fuel filter or a clogged inlet screen. Second, make sure you get the correct Facet pump. There are two identical-looking ones, the higher pressure one is for fuel injected cars and will drown your carb. Webers cannot stand more than 2-3 psi. The Facet pump should include a small pre-filter; use it. Hoses should all be SAE R30J6; now is the time to replace them if non-ethanol compliant.

Oh yeah, one more thing. While you're working back there, install a safety switch.
http://www.fiatspider.com/f15/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=31637

[phaetn]

I've always thought I should have a spare pump. Just got back from FFO. While there I bought the Facet cylinder type which is rated at 2.75 - 4.0 PSI @ 34 GPH vs. the cube type which is apparently 1.5 - 4.0 PSI @ 25 GPH (stats from A/R's site).

Matt from Midwest Bayless said it shouldn't overwhelm the carb (I've got a 32/36 EMPI) since it is a low pressure system. The advantage of this one is that it can be opened up and rebuilt.

Thanks for the tip about the Ford inertia switch. I will go and get one right away and install it when I am switching the pumps.

Cheers,
phaetn

[chrisg]

Sadly, I replaced my Facet box pump in my '71 Spider with a Mr Gasket (3ish psi) pump on the way to FFO. I have had fine luck with Facets (but where do you get them now? Mine are all 15+ years old & I get them from my workshop...) but what I was reminded of (and thus the reply) is the importance of its placement as low as possible and (of course?) it pushing rather than pulling. I am currently running also an EMPI 32/36 DFEV on this car with no return line.

[kmoses]

Facet list a fuel pump kit FEP42SV (Cube Pump in kit is 40104) for Fiat Spider years '74-'82 non-fuel injected. CarQuest stocks this kit under their part # CFP41501 and it's normally a store stock item. When I replaced mine, I also installed a relay that only sends power to the fuel pump when the car is being cranked or is running. If the engine shuts off, so does the fuel pump.

[vandor]

I have had fine luck with Facets (but where do you get them now? ...

We sell them:

https://autoricambi.us/products/fuel-pu ... t-electric

And also the larger type.

[chrisg]

thanks, Csaba, that is useful info. The relay is a nice idea, though I could imagine perhaps charge circuit issues fouling it up? maybe? is that the way the '74 original fuel pumps were wired with a relay? My intention to the same effect is to grab a couple handfuls of Ford family fuel pump inertia switches next time I am at Pull-a-Part

[kmoses]

The electrical circuit shown above using a cube relay to power the fuel punp is working great on my '79. I did make a bypass rig that has a toggle switch and a inline 10 amp fuse, I just unplug the relay and connect the bypass to socket #30 and #87 if needed. While reworking my car I did add a bolt through the factory ground point, two additional ground straps and three 12 gauge ground wires to the three ground pods (my alternator light is flicker free).

[squealingtires]

I ordered the Facet cube and installed it today. Now the car will not run with this pump. When idling, it will initially be fine and then after 20seconds it starts to sputter and then dies. I can then restart it and it repeats the same behavior of seemingly running out of fuel. If i try to raise the RPM then it dies sooner.
So I put the old pump back in and it runs fine. I just don't trust the old pump because it doesn't have the reliable history. This was an "Auto Pump" from New Zealand. I think this was a SU pump look-a-like and popular with the MG cars.

I checked all the lines, pulled hoses and monitored flow at the inlet to the carb and the return at the tank and I got a nice steady stream of fuel.

What do I look for now? Does this Facet Cube require anything else (like a restriction in the return plumbing to get the pressure up at the carb)?

[kmoses]

What Facet pump did you install (the number is stamped on the mounting flange/foot). When you mounted the new pump, is the filter and inlet at the bottom and the outlet at the top? Also, do you have a return line check valve installed, I know this does add some restriction to the line. One more thing to look at is your fuel line. I purchased some non-FI fuel line at one of the "Big" auto parts stores and when installed was not getting good flow. I found that if the bend radius was a too small, the hose was kinking and shutting off the flow. I ended up getting fuel line from a corner garage/shop that could be folded in half and it would not close off the flow.

[squealingtires]

Closing the loop on this issue. My problem was not related to the fuel pump, rather the carb float needle seat had become loose and had unscrewed which limited how much the needle valve could open. My problem was related to fuel starvation at the carb rather than fuel delivery. Just wanted to clear it up for anyone looking at a for a fuel pump.

[phaetn]

Thanks for the tip about the Ford inertia switch. I will go and get one right away and install it when I am switching the pumps.

I haven't had the inclination to install the Facet pump yet (I have finally learned to leave well enough alone but wanted a spare pump). I DID get around to the Ford inertia switch, though. I bought two for next to nothing at a local wrecker and pulled them from Ford Expeditions. They were easily accessible in the passenger kick panel area. It only required a Philips screw driver to get the plastic plate off and pliers with a wire cutter insert to separate the switch from the harness (I made sure to pull a lot back to get lots of excess wiring if need be).

Here's a vid of how I installed it and how it works:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/1974_fiat ... 079553265/

Cheers,
phaetn

[chrisg]

nice installation of the inertia switch. I finally snagged a small collection of them (plus one from a Land Rover just for fun, right) the other day because I finally ended up hitting one of the local pull a parts on word there was a complete CS1 124 Spider in stock....

[phaetn]

Any luck with the bits from the CS1?

Cheers,
phaetn

[dimitridodys]

I have a 1974 Spider with the original (and noisy) fuel pump. Is there a fuel filter back in the trunk? I was aware of only the filter under the hood by the carburetor. Thanks.