VW pollution - EA 189 diesel engine

[TX82FIAT]

One of the family cars is a 2010 Audi A3 TDI Premium Plus. I have 121,000 miles on this car and prior to about two weeks ago, I have had no real issues. Fun little sportback that gets 35 to 40 miles per gallon. I bought this car as an alternative to electric, for the first time in my life trying to be a little more friendly to the environment with respect to an automobile. Paid a premium for the diesel tech and Audi name.

Now I find out I've been putting 40 to 100 times the EPA limit of pollution into the environment because VW engineers lied to the public and installed a software defeat device to fool folks. The TPMS sensors have batteries that have worn out with good rubber still on the tire. Do, TPMS light on. A P0401 low flow EGR code has now produced the orange check engine light. This is tied to there EGR recirculation at high speed to re-burn exhaust gasses.

I am anti-law suit. We all get these class action notices in the mail for one thing or another. I consider these suits a necessary evil to keep companies honest, but I have never felt like a victim in any of these frivolous law suits. I just pitch them in the trash and move on. Well, I can honestly say I'm disappointed with VW and think they owe me something. What would you do?

-I purchased a vehicle paying a premium for technology that was false. I would not have purchased this car if not for the "Clean Diesel". Talk about a deceptive sales practice.

-I'm most likely going to have reduced performance with any emissions correcting fix related to the engine. Again, I purchased this car to have a sporty diesel. I would not have purchased it if it did not have the slightly higher performance than other diesel cars.

-When I go to sell the car it will most certainly sell for significantly less.

-When I take the car to the dealer for the eventual fix at some point between January 2016 and December 2016 it will be my time lost. I hate going to dealerships for anything other than warranty work.

-This car has been parked in my garage with my family getting out of the car in an enclosed space after pulling in. Exposure to diesel exhaust particles poses the highest cancer risk of any toxic air contaminant evaluated by OEHHA. ARB estimates that about 70 percent of the cancer risk that the average Californian faces from breathing toxic air pollutants stems from diesel exhaust particles. Has there been some health risk to my family? I now need to park this car outside where the potentially harmful exhaust fumes can more quickly dissipate. So, I own a car that can damage my family health and I really don't want to park in the garage.

Seriously, I'm a little bit upset about this one. Would you sue?

[narfire]

I understand VW has somewhere around $9 billion set aside for law suits. I don't believe it will be too difficult to receive something for being misled and the now reduced value of your vehicle. VW has admitted they are at fault, but I suspect some will ask for the moon and bung the system up.

[divace73]

I'd be pissed off as well, I do own a diesel, however it is a Sante Fe and looked into more towing capacity and economy for my decision to purchase, however when I do reverse it out of the garage, I do ensure the door to the inside house is closed. I think any fumes can't be good whether petrol or diesel.

I do also own a prius that supposedly produces smug instead if smog....great car getting you from A to B and economy wise but man it is BORING to drive.

I think these companies have a lot to answer for, it is the everyday car that is responsible for most of our pollution, not our 30 year old FIATs that some do gooders will have you believe, even if they are running a bit rich, as they are seldom driven and very few of them left when compared to the number of modern cars.

[So Cal Mark]

This VW situation will result in major change to the automotive world and it is interesting to watch. The $9 billion VW has set aside is not for law suits at all, it's the fine they're anticipating from the EPA. Fixing the cars will cost an unknown amount at this point, as the fix that VW is proposing is considered inadequate. If all they did was fix the software and put the car in emission testing full time, there would be a loss of power and fuel mileage. Analysts figure the cars will need a much larger catalyst to get through this. That may require a complete new exhaust system, and of course catalysts are covered by the 80000 mile emission warranty. How long will it take to complete certification for a new system?
Of course the cars have lost value, and most states now will require proof of recall repair before the car's license can be renewed so you can't ignore the fix.
I'm betting there will be a lot of aftermarket tuners offering to reverse the recall software fix for a tidy sum

[bradartigue]

Would I sue? Too late - I think the lawyers will f that all up for you in advance - but I wouldn't anyway, Audi was always good to us:

I'll tell you my Audi tales. I owned 7 of them (a 1999 A4, 2002 A6, 2003 A4, 2004 A6, 2001 Allroad, 2007 A4, 1998 Cabrio). Excellent cars, except for the A6s. The first A6, a 2002 A6 3.0 CVT, was the first or second CVT demo brought into the USA...at least according to the deal. It was beautiful, red, fast, and a total lemon. I think the first six months of ownership we had the car for 28 days. The transmission was a disaster. We called Audi USA, discussed the situation, and they had us bring the car back for exchange with the 2004 A6. Not some "trade" - my wife picked out a A6 quattro and we did an exchange (for a car stickered at $4k more than the CVT). Audi did the right thing.

Then.....the A6 quattro had some issues in its 4th year. The car had a suspension problem that caused a shaking at highway speeds. It would shake the wheel. Audi couldn't diagnose it sufficiently. In the process they broke the gas tank on the car. As the dealership tried to blame us for various woes Audi, the company, stepped in. We weren't looking to replace the car, but they agreed it was kind of f-ed up what with the dealer cracking the tank and ultimately making the car reek like gasoline. Again they made things right, gave us an excellent credit for the A6, more than blue book, and dropped the price of an A4 3.2 (a badass car by the way) down to wholesale.

So I say this, let the dust settle. This isn't a company of thieves, they had some guys who wanted an engine technology to be successful despite their inability to figure it out. They're stupidity and arrogance are going to cost VW/Audi a lot of money and will cost of lot of people their jobs. See if they can fix it and maintain the same performance; explore options. They may offer a buyback program that makes sense. The only people who will win in this deal are attorneys. You'll get about $10.00 and a card for free gas. I think if you work with Audi - not a dealership - with Audi - you'll get a good deal on a replacement car or repair for your car.

I have to admit I don't own Audis any more, but when I did the company did the right thing. The dealerships...well, another story for another day.

[So Cal Mark]

not my experience with Audi. I'd like to see VW and Audi thrown out of the US and take all of their cars with them. This was a blatantly criminal act and more than one person should see jail time, after they return all of the federal rebate money and refund the customers they duped

[TX82FIAT]

If they gave me a fair number for the car I would trade it in for another and call it a day just to get out of the headache. I have to say that this little car with 121K on the clock is still a pleasure to drive. The car is tight, balanced and fun. The Audi slogan "Truth in Engineering" might not serve them well right now. However, I've been happy with the product and would not hesitate to get into a new one.

[AndyS]

looks like VW has lots of company

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/anothe ... eid=yhoof2

[garion]

I've had 2 Audi's, my current 07 A4 2.0T Quattro and my beloved 04 A4 3.0 6sp Quattro... The 04 was totalled in an accident, and that car saved my life/serious injury.. I got smacked at 50mph+ in my B pillar on the drivers side.. I miss that car so much, compared to the 07..

Other than the 04's AC blowing up once, I've never really had a problem with the Audi's.. In fact, I'm in the middle of doing the brakes right now, and its a dream to work on compared to the wife's Jeep. ANd I've done the timing belt on it too..

With the VW diesel thing..... I would wait and see what they do... They patch it via software, reimburse you for loss of value, then go out and chip the car to get the performance back.. Thats if you don't care as much for the environment.. APR has a chip from what i can tell..

[TX82FIAT]

Follow up. Looking at how this VW cheat device has spread into other VW models including gas engines and is now crossing brands into Porsche and other high end cars. On 7 million cars sold annually world wide the decline reported of 5.1% is over 350,000 less cars sold. Per the 2014 financials they grossed 177.6 billion euro with a 6.2% net profit margin. Now think about discounts on the new model years to keep the inventory moving and plants running in a survival effort. They have build themselves up in recent years through many acquisitions to a world capacity trying to move from number 3 in the world to number 1 car manufacturer. These acquisitions cost money and they are carrying significant debt on the books. Take $1,000 Euro off the front end of each car sold to keep the plants running and you get at least $7 Billion Euro less in revenue combined with 9 Billion in know liability. I think the liability end of this will be more like $15 Billion when they are done. So we may have $22 Billion in losses from a debt leveraged company that only made $11 billion last year. I have not even factored in the cost to truly fix each one of these cars with actual parts re-design or software fixes.

If my math is right, they have two full years of profit at risk. That assumes the stock market death spiral allows them to generate capital. We may very well be looking at a dying company and multiple brands leaving the auto industry or being sold again at wholesale price. I traded my car in, took the loss of a few thousand dollars and picked up a 2013 Acura TL. If I see any money at all I consider myself fortunate.

[bradartigue]

Apparently one of the more technically inclined dealers has produced a modification that brings the diesel within the correct range with little noticeable change in performance.

Frankly I'm less bothered by the pollution than the lying and overcharging for the technology. It sounds dramatic to say "50 times the level" or "500 times the level" but in reality these cars pollute a lot less (in gross terms) than the average GMC. Every time I see a "Duramax" belch out a black cloud of smoke I wonder what exemptions they got - b/c I've never seen a new VW or Audi smoking like a bbq pit.

[grisoni]

Trucks do not need to meet the same requirements as passenger cars, be it for crash worthiness or pollution, or prob a lot of other things as well.

In regards to the OP, I think if you modified your other cars so that they no longer meet (even old) EPA specs you're just as much a cheat, sue yerself ?

Maybe that's why we never saw the Honda or Toyo diesels the rest of the world has, too difficult to satisfy some bureaucratic BS that will have little impact?
Lets face it, all we did is shift pollution overseas once we stop manufacturing stuff in the US and bringing their economies out of the 18 century, sure our cars are cleaner running, but most of India and the rest over there runs on small moped engine, some of the worst polluters.