VAS: Start Using Threadlocker (Cam Sprockets)

[Kevin1]

Allowing that it is difficult to judge the quality of an item until you have it in your hands to inspect, the set of cam wheels I received have proven themselves to be of good quality with no problems experienced in around 2,500 miles of driving. That said, I took my usual approach and checked the condition of all threaded holes, checked the condition of the bolts which clamp the two halves of the assembly together, and tightened the philips head screws for the flanges.

Now I have the head off the car again so, me being me, I plan to disassemble the cam wheels and put steel inserts into the threaded holes. Why? Because I believe in an ounce of prevention. Had these been from any other vendor I would still do the same thing. It is good shop practice, particularly where non-OEM, performance oriented parts are being employed. So locktite the screws, it isn't a big deal. Or a deal-breaker.

I find the vendor bashing around this site disconcerting. I doubt any of our vendors are making big money providing parts for 30 year old cars. The more of them we have the better it is for us all.

[toyfiats]

I find the vendor bashing around this site disconcerting. I doubt any of our vendors are making big money providing parts for 30 year old cars. The more of them we have the better it is for us all.

No, better to have a few top-notch vendors than a bunch of mediocre ones. For those of us that have been Fiat owners for a long time (20+ years), there was a time when we had many more vendors from which to choose, and some of them were particularly awful, and thankfully are no longer around to give the marque a bad name. It's too bad that a sub-par vendor that would have otherwise been left in the weeds years ago is instead able to trade off the well-earned reputation built up by others over many years.

[ScoopMan]

While considering the OP's pretty awful experience, I also see Kevin1's point. I see VAS get slammed on this site with some regularity. I have bought many parts from them and have had no complaints. Granted these are not parts that are exclusive to them like these pulleys.

I am not partial to any vendor, I have bought parts from IAP and AR as well, and all have been excellent, including VAS.

I am also on forums for Subarus and vintage Volvos, and those sites have their pariah vendors as well. Deserving or not, is another matter.

Aftermarket parts often have issues compared to OEM anyway. Anyone who mods cars learns this pretty quickly. That is why car forums are so useful, we can find out which parts are decent and which have problems, based on member's experience. Early adopters, beware....

[bradartigue]

While considering the OP's pretty awful experience, I also see Kevin1's point. I see VAS get slammed on this site with some regularity. I have bought many parts from them and have had no complaints. Granted these are not parts that are exclusive to them like these pulleys.

Perhaps it is because VAS has a reputation for things like this?

I'm one who fails to understand why you guys want parts like this to begin with, regardless of vendor, but it takes a few years of owning the cars until you start realizing the stock parts are pretty damned good.

[ScoopMan]

I pretty much go OEM all the way with the Fiat. I really do not care about some pretty anodized aluminum pulley or whatever. I just want things to work well and last a long time.

I will need to do a new head gasket for my newly acquired 1608 in the Spring, so I will take that opportunity to do a new valve job. I am going stock all the way. Keeping the stock camshafts for now.

If and when I need to rebuild my motor, I know I will be faced with a raft of decisions, like what kinds of pistons to use, when the OEM ones for the 1608 are apparently not made anymore. I will certainly entertain hotter camshafts at that time, so I would also be in the market for adjustable cam pulleys. I highly doubt I would get these VAS ones. I sure will not pay silly amounts of money for Guy Croft parts, no matter if some folks here talk about him like he is Jesus Himself.

The Subaru forum I am on has sections on aftermarket parts reviews, which I think would be very useful in our forum.

[TimpanogosSlim]

I pretty much go OEM all the way with the Fiat. I really do not care about some pretty anodized aluminum pulley or whatever. I just want things to work well and last a long time.

Weight reduction, bro.

I haven't really had bad experiences with VAS parts. I did have an issue with a distributor rotor that arrived w/o it's internal spring, followed by receiving a destroyed spring in an envelope, but eventually it was made right. But that was more a problem of how the manufacturer packages the rotor, and VAS not checking the box before it went out.

Couldn't tell you what happened to the spring from the rotor i took out.

Frankly, compared to some vendors, I'd rate VAS as average to good.

Volkswagen enthusiasts put up with the scourge of "Hans auto parts" aka Pete Rothenbacher. He has a dozen or so terrible websites with similar names and layout, sells super-cheap counterfeit parts sourced from china and parts sketchier, and has personally been responsible for hundreds if not thousands of grenaded engines.

Stuff like turbos that are assembled with glue, and not high temperature glue either.

There's also a pattern where his customer service is really excellent until anything goes wrong and then he just sort of disappears. Someone will spend a lot of money on a part that is visibly bad, and the initial response is very cordial and he promises to rush out a replacement.

Which then never materializes. And he never responds to email or phone messages again.

And then when you go to contest the charges with Visa, they tell you that due to some sort of paperwork issue they can't do it.

THAT, my friends, is a bad parts vendor.

[bradartigue]

Weight reduction? Seriously just admit you like shiny things. You grow out of it, it's okay.

We had our share of the same kind of vendor you describe, fortunately there seem to be none of those left in the world of fiats.

[ScoopMan]

I don't know if the difference in rotational inertia of these pulleys is enough to make a significant difference. Plus they are only spinning half as fast as the crank. Having a lighter flywheel and crank pulley would be a much bigger improvement, especially the flywheel because of its high polar inertia.

I am wondering what the reliability record is on the various lightened flywheels out there. Removing material increases stresses and increases the risk of fatigue related failure. Plus there is less thermal mass, and more susceptibility to warping and cracking. It would make me nervous...

So what are the other VAS parts out there that are allegedly crap? Some people here think they sell bad pistons, and that their exhaust systems don't fit. For that matter, does anyone's?

[Kevin1]

Accurately dialing in cam timing after ah head is shaved or a block is decked is important, and it can not be done with stock parts. Even some stock cams (installed) I measured were several degrees out of time. There are reasons that go beyond "shiny". Having Fiats since 1974 and several engine builds - Fiats and others - have taught me a lot. Trying to get more power from an engine sometimes requires using unconventional or non OEM parts. Some times they may need attention before installation. Big deal.

If you can't inspect a part, including cam wheels, windage trays, crank scrapers, external oil pumps, and on and on, and find it beyond reasonable tighten a dozen screws before installing said part, you have no real business (or chance of success) building most anything.

[ScoopMan]

I don't even think these are adjustable. Just pretty

I am totally with you vis-a-vis basic mechanical due diligence and common sense. Put some loktite on the screws. So what. Even the factory shop manual does not hold your hand as if you are a small child. It is assumed you know a little bit about what you are doing.

I find that every time I get a different kind of car, there is a whole learning process during which I screw things up more often than I get things right, and have to do them over. By the time I get to be good at a procedure it is probably the last time I need to do it

I would like to know about aftermarket part reviews. What are the GOOD adjustable cam wheels out there?

[bradartigue]

To the point on adjustable cam wheels you absolutely need adjustable wheels if you use hot cams.

The wheels in this discussion are not adjustable

[ScoopMan]

Thanks Brad, that is also my understanding. I will certainly be looking at hotter cams down the road. Right now I would be very happy just to get my 'new' 1971 ON the road

I see you are in Atlanta. Not a Yellowjacket by any chance? I am...

[bradartigue]

Nope I went to LSU in the early 90s, when we didn't worry about pesky things like winning football games

[TimpanogosSlim]

Weight reduction? Seriously just admit you like shiny things. You grow out of it, it's okay.

We had our share of the same kind of vendor you describe, fortunately there seem to be none of those left in the world of fiats.

I was joking - thus the "bro".

It's conceivable that shaving pounds off of the belt drive system may have a minor improvement in a race build, but yes, these are just shiny.