Possible? - Delta HF Engine in a 124

[fiatrn]

Out of pure curiosity, has anyone ever put the engine from a Lancia Delta HF 8V or 16V Integrale into a 124 Spider?

Note - I am NOT going to do this to my 74 Spider - it has a lovely 1800 that I enjoy as is.

I am curios IF his has been done. We can debate the morality, too, but first I am interested in establishing whether this has already been accomplished. I know with enough money it Could be done, but Has it been done?

182ish hp with stock Lancia components seems pretty powerful...I can forsee broken parts!

Jonathan
The Fiat RN
Denver, CO

[bradartigue]

The basic engine and head etc are pretty common fiat parts of the time, similar to your TC. Mounting it I think is not possible; it has a bunch of stuff mounted forward of the crankshaft, and I think the spider lacks the space.

[vandor]

If you look on turbo124.com there are several people who put the 16V turbo TC (basically the same engine as in the Delta, a direct evolution of the TC in the 124) in a 124, mostly 124 Coupes.
Some are said to be up pretty crazy HP numbers.

[toplessexpat]

My - that's a lot of engine to fit in (assuming including all the pieces that make it an integrale...)

[divace73]

If you are doing the head only is CAN be done and like most modifications its not straight forward.

Firstly the Exhaust and inlet are reversed on the 8V and 16 V heads.

The 16 Valve heads have the water outlet at the back which means either modification to the fire wall or further modification to the head. You will also have to flyncut your pistons (or get new ones) for the 16V

If you do the whole motor you have the whole East west VS north south issue and also there are balancing rods on the later motors that interfere where the starter motor usually sits.

You then will have to plumb the inlet and exhaust differently as well due to the head being East west and reversed.

I would love to do it but is is a lot of work, there a couple of cars here that have been done.

[CoupeFan]

As mentioned by someone else, most of the 16V conversions have been performed on 124 Coupes. I've never taken a clearance measurement between the firewall and the back of the head on a Spider, but on a Coupe, the Integrale head protrudes further back, necessitating cutting into the firewall for some clearance.

About the Hp numbers, it's crazy. I've seen 400 or more HP quoted. How the chassis stays in one piece without twisting to death, I don't know.

[toplessexpat]

Just fixed the engine diagram in my post above.

Beside that it's 90 degree different in the Delta than the Spider.... thats a LOT of engine.......

[divace73]

I know of a guy here in Sydney that was transplanting the 5Cyl turbo motor from the coupe until the car was caught in a fire, that would have been a real beast.

[Redline]

About the Hp numbers, it's crazy. I've seen 400 or more HP quoted. How the chassis stays in one piece without twisting to death, I don't know.

[fiatrn]

Looking only at the drawing posted by topless, I can't imagine the distributor pictured is going to fit in Any 124. So that would be the first stumbling block! The idea of a factory engineered, intercooled, balance shaft 2litre turbo must have gotten some maniac to fit one... At least on the Coupe there's a little extra room.

I was sort of hoping someone would post a photo of a full turbointercooled Delta 2.0 in a 124 Spider, just so I could say "wow"!

[Redline]

I can't imagine the distributor pictured is going to fit in Any 124. So that would be the first stumbling block!

Why not? Bugatti managed it over 80 years ago.





Anyway, I imagine if you are going to put that motor in a 124, rigging up a distributorless ignition would be only a small challenge.

[divace73]

no doubt if a transplant is done there will need to be a lot of modifications, I would remove the dizzy for a wasted spark or sequential setup where it can be placed anywhere. The last if the integrals had that set up.

[toplessexpat]

Thinking more on this... I don't think this would work, the physical dimensions of an engine designed to be fitted in a) a much larger engine bay and b) 90 degrees to the spider means that you'd likely end up removing many components and/or butchering the front end of the spider. Potentially this would destroy the elegant lines of the spiders, and almost definitely you'd create a death trap!

If you want an Integrale - there's a fair few out there that can be purchased for substantially less than it would take to do the swap...... With the added risk reduction of knowing it actually works.

Now - y'all can always supercharge and turbo charge a 2000 engine... That would be fun (especially with the counter direction of most people with trying to keep compression low!) and if anyone's interested I've got a spare intake manifold setup from a volumex.

A

[divace73]

It can be done and more probable with the head only but modifications are necessary. The cost would be far less than the price on an EVO 1 or 2, they have been steadily climbing now for some time.

and yeas putting a turbo or supercharger may be the way to go but will need engine modification if using high boost.

or

just have as much fun driving a working car... I miss my car as it's having work done on it