Does removing Emissions Control add power to an FI 2000?

[BellaMachina604]

Hey

I'm wondering if my 1982 2000 Fuel Injected Spider would benefit, torque and hp wise, from removing the air recirc and emissions control add-ons. There is no requirement here for a vehicle this old to pass emissions testing, and I'm always looking for a little more oomph. I've heard of Fiatniks gaining power on carbureted models by removing the smog control systems, but never heard of it for FI. Any step-by-step would be helpful too. Thanks.

[redcars]

Is that a caif car as my 81 & 82 FI spiders have no add on emission stuff that I know of.

[bradartigue]

Except for the catalytic converter there are no emissions control systems on the FI Spider that reduce power in any way. The car has only a simple vapor trap, that is there to keep the engine bay and interior from being stinky. So, no, there's nothing to remove.

Want more power in an FI car you can beat the inside of the catalytic converter out and leave only the shell, which adds about 3 HP (maybe), and you can pull the motor out and add high compression pistons. That's the easiest and most reliable stuff...after that you can get all radical with turbos and programmable EFI, but these are very expensive options.

[vandor]

Drilling holes in the plastic airbox also adds a few HP. Best mod would be to cut out the side or front of the air box and route cooler outside air to it. In the stock configuration it draws in warm/hot air that has passed through the radiator.

[BellaMachina604]

Thanks for the tips. Nice to know that I don't have to chase down any smog control gremlins.

I am running an Anza exhaust system with no cat currently, but was thinking of looking into a more freely flowing header as well. I was thinking of running a cold air intake as well. I am also upgrading to an aluminum rad and higher flow water pump just to keep it running cooler. Beyond that, I guess I am running her to the potential that she has, short of cracking open the engine and tinkering (which I am loathe to do).

[toplessexpat]

We've got a 2000. Getting cooler air into the intake would be my #1 suggestion. Currently with a magnaflow exhaust from the stock header back, with a resonator where the cat used to be. The stock exhaust manifold is pretty reasonable IMHO. When bled properly the stock cooling system is pretty good. I never get hot, even when in traffic in the south Texas heat. Adding a chin spoiler is a good idea if you've not got one. It directs more air through the radiator nicely. There's also an engine pan which most people don't have - that cuts down turbulence in the engine bay and let's it breathe as intended.
If the AFM has already been opened - doing the "spring move three teeth" mod will improve off the line (slightly).

I'd save my pennies for some mild compression. Best bang for the buck by far.

[BellaMachina604]

Thanks, I'll try the AFM trick and see what else comes to mind. I'm thinking of shedding a little more weight (the alu rad weighs 10-12 lbs less) by probably breaking up with my bumpers (I prefer the Abarth style blocks anyway). Chin spoiler is on it's way.

[narfire]

Not too much you can do without spending some serious loot with a FI engine. Personally I would not be opening up the AFM box to muck with the spring. I have opened it up to re-set the pins on the strip as I was having stuttering issues at lower RPM.
Want some fun, spend it on the front suspension, 1" front sway bar, springs and I recommend Koni yellow shocks. A brake upgrade is a nice thing to do as well, at least the braided steel flex lines. I like the 15" wheels and tires as well.
Yellow Point road (to Crow and Gate), Lower road to Crofton, circle tour from Cowichan Lake, Port Renfrew to Sooke are all on my Spider driving bucket list
Chris

[bradartigue]

Thanks, I'll try the AFM trick and see what else comes to mind. I'm thinking of shedding a little more weight (the alu rad weighs 10-12 lbs less) by probably breaking up with my bumpers (I prefer the Abarth style blocks anyway). Chin spoiler is on it's way.

The "AFM Trick" is a bad idea, whatever you "give" the low end you rob from the high end. The car is tricked to "think" there is more air than really is entering the motor, which increases the injector pulse time. This results in a slightly richer mixture, increased emissions, a potential for fouling the O2 sensor and the catalytic convertor, and the maximum injector output is reached earlier than it should - meaning you will lean out at top end.

The L-Jetronic simply isn't tunable - the best you can do is give it forced induction (turbo), increase the compression (piston swap), or modify the air box as described earlier (which adds a minimal gain, but it's almost free). Don't be fooled by K&N air filters or cone filters or any of that, they make the motor louder, but merely provide a placebo effect.

I find the most effective way to get maximum acceleration from L-Jetronic is to simply fine tune the ignition timing and be certain the vacuum capsule on the distributor is working and connected. The initial timing is done with the hose to this device pinched shut (you can't just disconnect it, it will create false air in the system).

[BellaMachina604]

Narfire: I have upgraded the front suspension as much as I can and still keep Collector Plates. You should try the Sunshine Coast Highway - Gibsons to Powell River. If ever there was a road made for this car. I will just work on getting her as close to fine-tuned as possible. Thanks all.

[toplessexpat]

well we can't agree on everything Brad!

Yes - you'll lose a bit at the top end, it's a balance like so many things. The O2 sensor will live for a while . Note: if the AFM is all nicely sealed I wouldn't muck about with it at all!

When you remove the bumpers - I suspect you'll be in the market for lowering springs... Removing the weight of a whole (albeit small) person does mean you increase your ground clearance!

[SeattleSpider]

Narfire: I am out of Seattle and one of my thoughts is a road-trip up through the Naramata area (Kelowna, etc.) I had the impression you had some beautiful country up there, great driving roads . . . and lots of good wine tasting. Thought I might go through there on the way to Lake Louise. Any thoughts for must see sights in your area would be appreciated.

BellaMachina604: Definitely want to do the Sunshine Coast. I hear great things.

In Washington, I am wanting to do (and recommend) a "Mountains of Fire" trip down the center of the Cascades (although we have many great road trips down here). This is a route I found out about from a motorcycle website. Starting in Enumclaw, WA you head south on HWY 410 to Cayuse Pass (with one side trip up to Sunrise on the east side of Mt. Rainier). From there you go south on HWY 123 which merges into HWY 12 . . . and go to Randle, WA. At Randle you turn south on essentially forest service roads (all paved). You are now heading south on 2515 road (I think). You take a side trip up NF Road 99 which takes you up to the eastern viewpoint for Mt. St. Helens - Windy Ridge I believe. Back on 2515 you head south to Curley Creek Road, to Meadow Creek Road, and finally to the Wind River Hwy. This latter takes you all the way to a junction with HWY 14 and the Columbia River (at Carson, WA). You are just west of Hood River, OR and the wind surfing community, and if you want to continue on the Mountains of Fire tour you can go on to Mt. Hood, or you can head east to Mt. Adams. The great part is it is all two lane windy forested roads - no freeways.

[bradartigue]

well we can't agree on everything Brad!

Yes - you'll lose a bit at the top end, it's a balance like so many things. The O2 sensor will live for a while . Note: if the AFM is all nicely sealed I wouldn't muck about with it at all!

When you remove the bumpers - I suspect you'll be in the market for lowering springs... Removing the weight of a whole (albeit small) person does mean you increase your ground clearance!

Nah -
There isn't a balance here at all (you are taking balance and making it not so). The AFM is simply a sensor; you can achieve the same "make it rich" result by using another temp sensor in the FI system or by installing injectors with more flow. Why people mess with the single most expensive and fragile part in the system is a mystery to me...for next to zero gain.

[toplessexpat]

You're a spoil sport! Next you'll be telling me to keep the stock bumpers on....?

[bradartigue]

You're a spoil sport! Next you'll be telling me to keep the stock bumpers on....?

Modify all you want, but modify things that actually contribute to performance.

The bumpers, well, you outgrow that as well, just don't throw them away, they are very expensive to ship new ones to you later in life.