Spidey's Dx

Danno · Post by **Danno** » Fri Feb 03, 2006 4:31 pm

yes, i've decided to nickname him (him, hmmm, that's a first for me) Spidey. anyway, talked to the mechanic who had originally been working on Spidey. It seems that he thinks there is something wrong with the Carb. I know it had a carb rebuild and/or tuneup about 3000 miles ago (based upon a reciept in the glovebox), but he still thinks that's probably what it is. He did say that if it's not that it's something in the exhaust system. I know that there were complaints that the cat was glowing red before, so maybe it's all crapped out now (might initially have been related to the carb, too). Anyway, I plan on doing the following, let me know if it sounds reasonable.

I'm gonna check everything like I said before cause it's been sitting so long, then I'm gonna the exhaust off right before the cat and just leave it off for now. then I'm gonna try to get it running. if it was the cat only then it should run at this point, right?

if I'm still having problems I'll take the carb off and clean it really well? any tips hints, etc on this process? Is there anything I should look for that would lead me to believe I'd need a new Carb. anything that's common in the 2.0L fiats?

So Cal Mark · Post by **So Cal Mark** » Sat Feb 04, 2006 11:08 am

any condition that allows excessive amts of unburned fuel into the catalyst can cause it to overheat and potentially melt down inside. Glowing red is a certain indicator or either a misfire or overly rich mixture.
Cutting the cat off and inspecting it isn't a bad idea, but curing the cause is a requirement. The only real reason to replace the carb would be if the carb body was worn at the throttle shafts or has stripped threads. The carb probably needs more than just cleaning, you need to figure out why it's running so rich. Could be jetted wrong, have a bad float or leaking needle and seat.

Danno · Post by **Danno** » Sat Feb 04, 2006 12:47 pm

So Cal Mark wrote:The carb probably needs more than just cleaning, you need to figure out why it's running so rich. Could be jetted wrong, have a bad float or leaking needle and seat.

ok, so what's the fix should any of these problems be the cause? can a "carb tune-up kit" fix it, or do I need a new carb at that point?

Danno · Post by **Danno** » Sat Feb 04, 2006 1:18 pm

has anyone used this to clean and seal their gas tank? I imagine mine's not horrible, but I have to get rid of everything in there right now anyway, so i figure now's a good time to do it!

i found it on jcwhitney's site

So Cal Mark · Post by **So Cal Mark** » Sat Feb 04, 2006 3:45 pm

the only reason to line the tank is if it has rust inside. But if that's the case, I'd replace the tank. Used units are pretty cheap

Danno · Post by **Danno** » Sun Feb 05, 2006 2:32 pm

thanks mark. I just got in from draining and removing the tank (that part was for fun).

I looked inside and it was pristine! so no worries here. I've never removed a gas tank before, so i enjoyed the learning experience.

tank removed!

what's this? three into one and the "one" is crimped. is that a problem?

pump, filter, etc.

just another picture....

Danno · Post by **Danno** » Sun Feb 05, 2006 7:12 pm

ok, it's all hooked back up and I got half a tank of new gas. Plugs look good so I didn't replace them.

Oil was a teensy bit low, so I added some. also poured a few drops into each cylinder before trying to start.

battery is new.

Turn the key, power is good. I can hear the fuel pump ticking away (is it normally so loud?)

Turn the key the rest of the way, nothing, turn again engine is turning over great. Something is funky with the ignition (like key ignition, not coil, etc) cause it doesn't always kick the starter....

Sprayed a little starter fluid vrooom, engine sounds strong and mechanically sound for having sat so long, maybe a little rough, but then I'm running off of starter fluid! died in a second.

I try for 15 minutes to start this stupid thing, but to no avail. one interesting thing is that I'm not smelling much gas. shouldn't I be flooding this thing (i think to myself).

i get out with key on, hear the fuel pump still. look at carb pull throttle cable, nothing. shouldn't I be seeing gas squirt in there?

I guess something is askew here.

another thing i noticed is that there is this stupid clicking noise coming frolm the glove box area. it's like Click-click with a 1 second pause between the clicks. then 2-3 seconds of silence, then repeat.

what's going on here? It's been so long since a carb'ed car for me that I haven't the foggiest where to go next.

mdrburchette · Post by **mdrburchette** » Sun Feb 05, 2006 7:24 pm

Did you replace any of the fuel filters when you had it down? You could pull a fuel line and put the end in a bucket and see if the fuel pump is pumping any gas into it. If you're getting gas, then maybe some of your acc pump diaphragm isn't good or you have clogged jets. Ask me how I know all this....I just went through it with a set of dual Webers. Of course, you guys go ahead and chime in. Being a female has it's many limitations!

Danno · Post by **Danno** » Sun Feb 05, 2006 7:35 pm

mdrburchette wrote:Did you replace any of the fuel filters when you had it down?

No I didn't, and judging by the pristine condition of the tank when I drained the old fuel out, this shouldn't be a problem, but i might look into it.

You could pull a fuel line and put the end in a bucket and see if the fuel pump is pumping any gas into it.

I think I might try this.

If you're getting gas, then maybe some of your acc pump diaphragm isn't good or you have clogged jets.

I just said to my wife like three minutes ago. "I asked on the forum, i wonder if anyone will think its the diaphragm?" I hope that's all it is, apparently it's a 17.50 fix....

Ask me how I know all this....I just went through it with a set of dual Webers. Of course, you guys go ahead and chime in. Being a female has it's many limitations!

dual webers...mmmm, tasty. but i think I'll try to get what i have running first, then upgrade later.

So Cal Mark · Post by **So Cal Mark** » Sun Feb 05, 2006 10:03 pm

the engine should still run with a bad accel pump diaphragm, it just would stumble while accelerating. You may have a leaking fuel line either back by the rear axle or a gummed up carburetor. The needle and seat may be gummed up, or the small screen at the inlet of the carb may be plugged.

Next time you do this, use atf rather than oil in the cylinders. Oil will foul the spark plugs while atf will burn.

Danno · Post by **Danno** » Sun Feb 05, 2006 10:18 pm

So Cal Mark wrote:the engine should still run with a bad accel pump diaphragm, it just would stumble while accelerating. You may have a leaking fuel line either back by the rear axle or a gummed up carburetor. The needle and seat may be gummed up, or the small screen at the inlet of the carb may be plugged.

Next time you do this, use atf rather than oil in the cylinders. Oil will foul the spark plugs while atf will burn.

thanks for the advice mark, i knew that about the ATF, cause you mentioned it before, but I had none, so I thought with the small amount I'd probably be ok.

anyway, I checked the fuel right before the carb and sure enough key on it spits fuel out just fine (i know, probably not the smartest place to check for fuel!!! messy and dangerous)

so I commenced with a complete removal of the carb and it was icky gunky in there. maybe that's my problem, i dunno.

Danno · Post by **Danno** » Sun Feb 05, 2006 10:19 pm

oh, and boy am I gonna need some help hooking this carb back up, I unplugged about a hundred hoses from this thing and did it all willy nilly without paying attention to where each one goes

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So Cal Mark · Post by **So Cal Mark** » Sun Feb 05, 2006 11:46 pm

oh yeah, the 79 and 80 carb models have LOTS of vacuum hoses, mostly emission related. Is there an underhood diagram still in place? The emission tag usually had the diagram attached to it.

Mad-Machine · Post by **Mad-Machine** » Mon Feb 13, 2006 8:29 am

becareful with those hoses. Most of them are plastic and by this time quite brittle and prone to breaking/shattering when you try and force them to do anything.

Danno · Post by **Danno** » Mon Feb 13, 2006 1:16 pm

Mad-Machine wrote:becareful with those hoses. Most of them are plastic and by this time quite brittle and prone to breaking/shattering when you try and force them to do anything.

well, hoses weren't too bad actually, this carb has been worked on before. I found a receipt for a rebuild about 3000 miles ago. I still think the carb is the culprit.

BUT, i'm not gonna worry too much about it right now, cause I just worked out a deal with Jon Logan (you prob recognize him as the VP/Membership Director of Fiat Lancia Unlimited) where he'll be shipping me an 1800 intake with a rejetted and rebuilt 32 adfa carb (for a decent price, of course). SO, I'm awaiting that and not screwing with this old carb ANYMORE!!!! BTW, i actually found a picture of the smog vacuum hoses for my carb somewhere (think it was mirafiori.com) so I used that on my last install/test of my cleaned up carb....