no start issue and parasitic draw--related?

[bagodonuts]

My 81 2000 spider has been running really nicely lately, though the cold start valve doesn't work quite right. when it's cold the blue plug at the front of the intake manifold has to be plugged in...but if the engine is warmed up i have to open the hood and unplug it for the engine to start easily. anyway...

i've had the problem with the (new gel-type $$$$) battery being run down to 9V or so while the car sits in the garage. Yesterday i charged it and today i went to fire it up and the car just kicked and stuttered and stalled...over and over and over again. sometimes it fires a bit and sounds like its missing. i looked through this forum and found talk of the Air Flow sensor causing similar problems so i went back to the garage and uncoupled the large hose from the air flow sensor on top of the air cleaner and poked my finger in the hole and flipped at some flapper door that was about 1/4 inch from being completely open (allowing air to flow freely from air filter area to large hose that leads to FI stuff). I tried to start the car while this was uncoupled and it revved up smoothly and promptly died. After a few more unsuccessful attempts i re-coupled the hose and tried (for no good reason) to start the car again. It fired up and ran smoothly and normally for a minute or so. I thought i would try a drive so closed the hood with a bit of a slam and the car stalled instantly, as if the slam jarred something back. Successive attempts to start the car produced the initial symptoms.

obviously, i don't really know what i'm doing. my spark plug cables aren't in the best condition but moving them around and away from one another had no effect. i smell gas as i'm trying to start it and have flooded it in the past but i don't think that's what's happening now.

any guidance would be appreciated.

thanks

[GeorgeT]

You need to get the Fuel Injection Diagnosis Manual (available from various vendors and may be available on line as well). The first problem could be related to a bad thermo-time sensor: when cold, the sensor allows the cold start injector to be energized but when the engine is warm it does not. Other issues could be related to the distributor, the double relay, the air flow meter etc. You will have to go through the FI system and test each component as outlined in the Diagnosis Manual. Get a good multimeter and noid light.

[bagodonuts]

I think i have it narrowed down to the double relay. This document was particularly helpful and easy to follow:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3359580/Bosch%2 ... ir%20p.pdf


i still have a problem with parasidic draw. any chance the double relay is at fault and i can kill two terrible birds with one stone here?

[bagodonuts]

replaced double relay. the car starts now, which it didn't before but it stumbles and smells like its running very rich. I am going to check spark at the plugs after work.

I was really hoping to hear it purr. there are the beginning of some cracks in the big air intake hose. I've ordered another so maybe THAT will bring the purr back....though i am dubious.

[majicwrench]

IF it runs no need to check for spark, it is there. If you have cracks in intake tube you can wrap it in electircal tape and see if it makes any diff. Intake tube leak makes it run too lean. Coolant sensor on coolant T is possible culprit when running rich.. Connector often fails. It needs to be clean and tight.
Keith

[bagodonuts]

bit it definitely seems like its missing. i have to find an opportunity to check. How does one diagnose the coolant sensor?

[bagodonuts]

in the first post i mentioned slamming the hood and the motor stalling. I believe now that when the hood came down it pushed on the wiring leading to the coolant temperature sensor. The connection there is rather loose and i have been able to recreate my studder and stall problem by pressing on the wires and connector.

2 Questions....

1. these connectors are pretty generic, right? i can buy any bosch FI connector on ebay and splice the wires?


2. i had replaced the dual relay following a troubleshooting checklist (that i refer to in this thread...but doesn't lead to the thread...sorry). It reads:

"If engine starts then stops:
Check output to fuel pump from fuel pump relay of relay set by disconnecting hose to air flow sensor. Connect test light to temrinal 88d of relay set and ground. Turn ignition on. Move sensor flap and check test light.

With sensor flap closed, test light should be off [CHECK]. With sensor flap open [meaning when i'm pushing on the flap, right?], test light should come on. [It did not come on with the original relay. It STILL did not come on with the new relay.]. If test light does not operate, go to check 25."...

...Check 25 reads: "Check input to fuel pump relay of relay set:
Connect test light to terminal 86b of relay set and ground. With flap closed, light should be off [CHECK]. With flap open, light should come on [CHECK]. If test light operated properly, replace relay set [I did replace double relay with no effect]. [To conclude...] if light does not operate, check wires. If wires are good then replace air flow sensor."

Am i to conclude that the "new" (it was actually used [ebay] and shows signs of being rebuilt--looks like it was close up with superglue) double relay is no good or is there another explanation?

[majicwrench]

First things first. If you can move coolant sensor wires and make it shudder, you need a new connector and a new sensor.
Fix what is broken.
Keith

[redcars]

Just a small point that sensor should be on the bottom of that tee not the top. Not that this will fix you problem but if it is on the bottom like it is suppose to be then closing the hood will never effect it.