What to do first!

[Glyn]

I was sitting in my car waiting for my Wife to finish shopping and came across this car on Craigslist. It is a 1978 one owner car sitting in garage for last 20 years. Went to pick it up and it would not even roll. After coming-longing it out it started to roll but steering frozen. When I got home the tie down straps on tires free up the steering, first good thing to go my way.
Not sure what to do first. I don’t want a show car but would like it to be as reliable as possible. I am a teacher with quite a bit of time and not a lot of money. I did grow up on a farm where we had to fix farm equipment all the time, my Dad was cheap. I’m not an automotive expert but due have good general knowledge of repair work and also a friend who sells body parts and fixed salvage cars to sell. Just guessing I was going to start with drive train, breaks, body/paint, and last interior. The seller told me the timing belt broke and died then towed back and parked the car where it sat for 20 years. When I took apart a few engine parts I discovered timing belt it in place.
Basic questions I need help with:
1. Steps to restore car.
2. Do I need to change all the engine gaskets?
3. Buy car kit and rebuild carbs.
4. Replace every rubber hose on car – I’m assuming yes.
Here are some pics of my new project. (Or should I say money pit)









Yes, a Fiat will fit throw french doors. My wife wanted my workshop to match the our house. The things you have to do to get a workshop.

[vandor]

First you need to determine the condition of the engine:
-Does it turn over?
-Are the cams and aux shaft timed correctly?
-Does the engine have compression?

If the engine is locked up it might be better to find a better project car, or a parts car with a good engine.

If the engine will run then the first step would be a major tuneup: replace oil, coolant, points, condenser, plugs, carb kit, fuel filter, TIMING BELT (the one on there is 20 yo), possibly radiator and heater hoses.

Then you will want to drive it, however the brakes on these cars don't like to sit and the calipers are likely locked. Buy kits for them and take apart and clean everything. If you are lucky the caliper pistons are not rusty. You will invent new curse words when trying to reassemble the rear calipers Oh, and a new master cylinder might be cheap life insurance :-]

Good luck!

[dmwhiteoak]

Hello and welcome Glyn. Looks like lots of fun ahead for you. Where do you hail from?

[Glyn]

Thank you Vander, I was hoping for a starting point. Your suggestions were very helpful. I will be able to check the compression Sunday or beginning of the week. What should the compression be in each cylinder? If I have good compression should i change the gaskets on the engine-ie. head, valve, etc.?

Dmwhiteoak, I live in Lake Charles, LA.

[124JOE]

comp should be about the same across all 4
i let mine sit for 2 yrs and the carb was leaking gas "after starting".i let it sit for a day,the gaskets in the carb
swelled and was fine ---i have a 32-32 adfa carb i rebuilt on the shelf,ill sell it for $100."its from my 78"
i replaced it to a 32-36 efdv

start with a new fuel filtter
be sure you have good tires and brakes before you go anywhere
you need to drain any gas and use premium
test the spark and comp

all and all great find

[narfire]

All great advice. Fuel tank clean? these tanks are known to rust and flakes will bung up the intake. Fuel filter of course.
when you first start flowing fuel through the old fuel lines, watch carefully for leaks. I did not replace one old soft line and when fuel started through it for the first time, the interior of the line was rotted and fuel started to pour out.
Fuel delivery sorted out... then check spark... pull plugs,perhaps a few squirts of oil in each cylinder and turn over by hand. Can do this with all plugs out and I put a 19 mm on the intake cam nut and pull carefully. Got spark ?? check timing and car is at TDC and all marks line up. As Vandor mentioned, dist cap, points, condenser ect...
New timing belt... a definate piece of mind. Car runs then brakes. Change fluid and blow out the lines. Make sure you can stop is a good thing eh..
All is good then onto the next steps... (rubber flex disc for example)
have fun, driving these cars make all the attention they sometimes need all worth while.

[vandor]

> What should the compression be in each cylinder?

A good used engine will usually have ~120 psi. A rebuilt one with stock compression will have ~150 psi.
Ideally you should not have more than 10% variation between cylinders. However, I have driven worn-out cars that had compression readings in the 75-90psi range and they still ran...

> If I have good compression should i change the gaskets on the engine-ie. head, valve, etc.?

I would not change the headgasket unless there is a problem with it. I would change other gaskets only if they leak.

[CajunMike]

Interesting. Looks like u have an air conditioner unit in there?

[giuliot60]

Looks like a nice project.

There is plenty of good advice to be had here, as you probably already noticed. Read through as many posts as you can to get familiar with the issues these cars have. Mirafiori.com has a lot of good advice as well. Like this when you get your car running: http://www.mirafiori.com/faq/content/el ... estore.htm

I have a feeling that with a little TLC you'll be up and running. Like Csaba (Vandor) said, first make sure the engine is good. Then everything you do will give you more confidence to keep on going, and before you know it you'll have a good understanding of the car.

Welcome. Good luck. And keep us posted.

[Glyn]

I think I was smoking crack when I bought this car, not sure what I got myself into!

Getting more nervous about the engine. I checked the oil level for fun and had two to three times too much oil on dip stick. Drained oil and looked thin and brown/black, no white color at all.

How do you check if engine is good or not? I don’t think I can check compression without timing belt. Previous owner said it had broken timing belt, but it was in place. I did pull plugs and put a little marvelous mystery oil in each cylinder. Then attempted to turn it over using 1 ½ socket on main. It moved a little but I realized the cams gears weren’t turning. The timing belt gooves broke off belt and only the main crank was turning. I stopped in fear of bending valves. The seller also did tell me that he hit something on the road and oil pan started leaking. At that time he had trouble finding an oil pan gasket and used the tube gasket stuff. Knowing I had to change the oil pan gasket my original plan was to remove the oil pan, valve covers(thought they may have been cork being that old), and head with the engine still bolted down. I was thinking I could visual look at everything while changing most gaskets. Again I’m not a mechanic and may have been a stupid plan. Do I need to pull engine out and sent to mechanic? Basically not sure how to tell if engine is good or not. Scared to turn main crank without timing belt in place. Hate to work on carbs, gaskets, electrical, hoses, and belts if engine is bad. Hard to analyze not knowing for sure why the engine stop running in the first place, could always hope due to electrical problems. How to tell if motor is good or bad at this point?

I did plan on changing every rubber hose on the car and yes there is a boat load. Most of the hoses so far seem bad, hard and not flexible.

CajunMike - Yes, it does have an air conditioner. Another thing that probably won’t work at point.

[n10zf8]

I think when any of buy these things we are a little high on something . First get a few shop manuals. There is a lot of information on this forum and others about these cars...most of us buy these things as they are languishing inappropriately in a barn or garage and so you will find lots of stories of horror and triumph.
Biggest things I have learned
1. NEVER get scared, it's yours now you can't take it back.
2. I remember the first time I drove a spider it was a 72 with a 1600 and dual Weber carbs an Abarth road version, I have never had a high like that from any car since!
3. Top down 114mph on a nice back road on a warm day is worth all the trouble you will find in your dusty diamond!!

Good luck and enjoy the triumph is far greater than the horror.

[124JOE]

[dmwhiteoak]

Use the pic joe has posted above. Replace the timing belt and go from there. Just think, when you get this one kinda where you want it you can go out and buy another to do it all over again.

[vandor]

>The timing belt gooves broke off belt and only the main crank was turning.

There is a good chance that some of the valves are bent.

>I stopped in fear of bending valves.

I don't think you can do that by hand.

> my original plan was to remove the oil pan,

You have to unbolt the engine mounts and jack up the engine by the bellhousing to get enough clearance.
Even then the pan may hit the oil pump and you'll have to unbolt the pump before it all slides out.

> Do I need to pull engine out and sent to mechanic?

No, we can walk you through it

>Basically not sure how to tell if engine is good or not.

Buy a $16 timing belt, put it on, then you will be able to do a compression test.
However, if you have bent valves a compression test won't tell you anything (other than you have bent valves

To check for bent valves remove the valve covers and check the valve clearances with a feeler gauge. Normal clearance is ~0.017" for intake and 0.019" for the exhaust. They should be somewhat close to those figures. If a valve has a huge clearance that means it is bent and thus not closing all the way.

[Glyn]

Ordered timing belt today. Also went to church, will need all the help I can get. Thanks for your help.