political thoughts - read at own peril!

[TX82FIAT]

Maytag, well said about Ron Paul. This is a topic that has a lot of opinions. I don't think the President is a bad man. I think he is shaped by experience that is limited. I don't think that people engaged in conversation about politics because they care about the future of the USA need to ever be refered to as frothing trolls. There was a time when those that sacraficed for the future well being of the country were called Patriots.

[EddieJames]

I think barry is a criminal and a federal rapist that should be removed from office and jailed, along with 90%+ of his thug administration.

[courtenay]

It's sad when legitimate political debate - anywhere - gets hijacked by over the top hyperbolic character assassination.

[EddieJames]

That's one of the real beauties of our country down here Bruce. We ALL have a voice. At least for now. Hopefully we can put a stop to the destruction of liberty here when we vote this November. I have my fingers crossed indeed.

And my assessment is nowhere near the top or even over the top. There are a lot (millions) of people who feel even stronger about the loser that has been placed in the highest office in our land. There are a lot of people reeling from voter's remorse. They've seen the reality of incredibly high - sustained - unemployment that has no sign of easing, millions of people with no hope for work, the largest number of people on food stamps in the history of our Country with nothing being done by the "OBlameSomeone" administration, the most spending by an administration in the history of our country with NOTHING to show for it, the erosion of everything the U.S.A. stands for.

Believe me, I took it easy on the idiot compared to what a lot of people here are saying.

[Kent124]

It's sad when legitimate political debate - anywhere - gets hijacked by over the top hyperbolic character assassination.

99% of the politicians are scoundrels and don't have a positive character to assassinate

[Kent124]

I don't think the President is a bad man.

Venal would be more appropriate.

[Jimb]

Do you not think it will take many years beyond a political term to recover from your country's strife? Yet understandably people want to see results sooner....and therefore any politician who's in power will have a thankless battle. Two issues that would seem need immediate attention are your healthcare and regulation of the banking industry. From what I have read on Obama's proposed health reform it seemed to be an excellent step in the right direction, yet it got beaten up because the opposition wasn't going to sit back and let such an important milestone as this go to the Democrats.
A problem that historically plagues all levels of government from all parties.
And I do believe we are all extremely fortunate to be living in Democratic countries and therefore we should embrace ALL others views and opinions even if they are significantly different than ours and grow by listening and learning.
Just my opinion of course.
Jim

[maytag]

Obama's proposed health reform it seemed to be an excellent step in the right direction, yet it got beaten up because the opposition wasn't going to sit back and let such an important milestone as this go to the Democrats.

You are working from an assumtion that it really IS a good thing, and only party-politics got in the way of it passing.

But we have a fundamental issue here that is much deeper than political affiliation. And it is quite probable that it's not unique to the U.S.A (I've lived in many countries, but this is the only country I've ever been a citizen of, and therefore cared about the political issues therein)

We each have a different place where we draw the line between Personal Responsibility and caring for those who can't or won't. Personally, as I get older and smarter, and as I have more to give, I am more inclined to feel a responsibility to care for the community and those within it. As such, I try to give generously when and where I can. But I have no interest in caring for those who won't, or who have taken significant risks financially without their own backup plan because they know there is a safety-net. For these few, welfare is a strategy.
So when Obama-Care comes around, many of us see a step towards "socialism". We are to be compelled to give, and to support those who can't or won't. It becomes an entitlement for those who want it, and a burden on those who supplement it. It's a distinct step towards creating yet another government dependency.
I do not wish to offend, or to begin a "my country is better because". In the late 80's / early 90's, I lived in beautiful France for about 4 years. That country has a rich history and much that the world could benefit from in their culture. But I saw first-hand what the government hand-outs created. A pervasive lack of ambition, exacerbated by the immigration issues creating racial jealousy. Chomage was rampant, because it was as easy to live comfortably without a job as it was with one.

I do not want to be compelled to give. I would like to give freely, in the way I find to be most beneficial, to those whom I deem need my help the most. There is a place for a program to provide basic subsistence. But let's not expand it to ObamaCare.

[TX82FIAT]

Again Maytag, well said. I work hard and give generously to organizations that work in efficient ways to help others. When the US gov steps in and states that a company has to cover my kids until they are 26 years of age I think a line is crossed. At some point all of us must live within our means. If my kids need to be on my healthcare when they are 26 years old then I have done something wrong as a parent, My kids have done something wrong as adults. At no point does that make it right to dictate soemone else pay for these services as a matter of private employment.

These companies will pass the costs of these additional benefits on to consumers in the price of products and services. To argue this is the same as to argue changing minimum wage has no impact on the economy. Hell, just make min wage $30/hour and see the impact on the economy. Fair = enjoying the fruits of education, labor and demand. At what point did we stop judging what was fair based on our own merits. People are walking around like little kids and pointing fingers at others to determine what is fair. You want what other people have then earn it. Look at how they got where they are and execute a plan.

[EddieJames]

I echo those same conments. And it isn't only that a socialist program like "OBlameocare" that was passed illegally is a dis-incentiviser; it is also because the federal government is incredibly inefficent because they spend others' money with ZERO regard. They didn't have to work for it. They forcefully take citizens' money through excessive taxation and then they piss it away with no regard. Obamacare is a form of destruction of the free market and FREEDOM. Oh just wait until the lines start and the death panels decide who gets treatment and who doesn't. They are already outlawing large soft drinks in major cities here. This isn't a futuristic science fiction story. This is actually happening in the freedom capital of the world today.

There are already doctors bailing out of the industry and pursuing other forms of income and careers because of the impending Obamacare nightmare. I know - I have three brother in-laws who are all doctors. One told me that in a 30 minute session with a patient, 20 of those minutes are used for the pile of paperwork and then they may or may not get paid.

I honestly don't think either side of the aisle would want to take "credit" for this horrific legislation. There are MANY democrats that distance themselves from it. It will destroy the doctor /client relationship and research efforts.

[CajunMike]

Two issues that would seem need immediate attention are your healthcare and regulation of the banking industry. From what I have read on Obama's proposed health reform it seemed to be an excellent step in the right direction
Jim

First of all thanks to the members for a civil political discussion. It's about the cars first and foremost and regardless of what members political persuasions are I still respect all members who contribute here. Now back to the discussion. The thought that a trillion dollar healthcare overhaul in this country is a step in the right direction just causes me to scratch my head. I've been a healthcare accountant for 13 years and have been through several major changes in Medicare reimbursement through those years. Some good, some bad, and some disastrous. As someone in the know of our current state of healthcare I have absolutely zero faith that the us federal gov can run another massive entitlement program when they can't even run Medicare. Some background here. When the us embarked on the Medicare ship many years ago, reimbursement from Medicare was "cost based" meaning that healthcare providers would account for the cost to provide care for Mcr patients and the gov would pay for that. Without writing a book let your imagination run wild on what "paying for costs" can do for the "costs". If I pay you for your cost then do you really care what that cost is? It's paid for. Thus began the rampant cost increases in healthcare. From the 60s to the 80s costs went through the roof. So much so that in 1986 the fiscal responsibility act finally provided incentives for providers who managed their costs by establishing "tefra" targets. Come in under the targets you get a "bonus". The 1986 act also started the ball rolling on the phase out of cost reimbursement. But by then the damage was done. Cost reimbursement phase outs began in the 90s through establishment of perspective pay programs that paid set amounts for various procedures. Better system but the payments included annual provisions for inflation increases and set salary ranges by region. All measures meant to control costs but just exacerbated the problem. I could go on and on but the underlying theme here is that government is the healthcare problem and more of it in healthcare will be more of a problem.

I will have more comments later when time allows.

In addition I would also like to add that my brother is a surgeon. His educational resume is: 4 years college, 4 years med school, 5 years surgical residency, and 1 year surgical fellowship. 14 years of education and over $100000 in student loans. Yet some still envy the fact that he will make north of $300k per year. His personal 14 year sacrifice should be rewarded handsomely and applauded. No one seems to appreciate the fact that for the last 6 years if his residency he worked at state hospitals providing 80 hours a week of surgical expertise for about $40 k per year. It is a grueling road for a physician.

[Jimb]

I do find this thread extremely interesting and informative...and I sincerely hope it remains a civil debate.
Thanks,
Jim

[divace73]

coming from the other side of the world and am 'somewhat' insulated (I guess with the global world we live in everyone feels the ripples??) from a lot of it I have also found this thread very interesting and informative, keep it up.

[dantye]

I suppose now someone will go to their congressman and get them to sponsor a law that will exact a fine on those posting OFF-TOPIC on forums. --- But that's not what government is for.

But then, THIS THREAD is NOT what this forum is for.

[maytag]

But then, THIS THREAD is NOT what this forum is for.

it's not?
Then what is the "off-topic & Social" section for, exactly?