What is private?

[Fiatmonkey]

WOW, you never know what will be used for or against you in anything.... You can't be sure who will understand the privacy of email or a letter anymore. For that matter you can't be sure every phone call you make isn't recorded. No matter what happens out there or anywhere I go in the world, I don't want my personal emails posted anywhere (no matter what is in them). Just as I would never want a letter scanned and posted. I think after some posts on this website recently that a person should be aware that calling people may just be safer. I don't think it is appropriate under any situation to show another persons email, no matter what point needs to be made.

To Mark (the one looking for a cross-matrix) I am sorry that you were put out on the spot like that, and I hope that other members of this forum contact you with the same sentiment.

The internet is an terrible place. One where a Monkey can't swing safely from Tree to Tree.

[So Cal Mark]

I hadn't read that thread, what happened?

[Fiatmonkey]

You'll just have to read it, but I would think taking down the post would be appropriate.

[So Cal Mark]

I read all of the posts, but I can't tell what might have been private or written in confidence. I can accept that members have differences of opinion and all of us can relate to good/bad buying experiences. I know most of the other vendors and some I deal with and some I won't, just like everyone else.
As for the original question about a matrix, some companies list the OEM number along with their own, but it would take an outside source to research all of the various aftermarket part numbers and how they cross to Fiats' numbers. It's unreasonable to expect any company to do that now, these parts are such a small percentage of sales for any of these companies it's a miracle they still produce them at all. As for original-type replacement parts, it's only going to get worse, and more expensive as demand wanes. So, while $60 for an oil pressure switch seems ridiculous, what is the tipping point for the mfg to discontinue production? When demand is for 100 a year? When price is $150 and they don't sell 10 in a year?

[joelbert2k]

I think what monkey was complaining about is the posting of the emails between Csaba and Mark.
I'm in agreement with him. I don't see the need to post them for all to see. I do see that Autoricambi was trying to show their response to the nut mix up but I'm not sure that was the proper way to do it.

Just my 2 centavos.
Joel

[maytag]

I didn't see a thing wrong with it. nothing.
Csaba (or whatever his name is) was being called-out for something, and it was being portrayed in a specific light, that was very damaging. But Csaba had proof..... so to me, that means Opus was engaged in SLANDER, at least. (allthough to use Opus' words, he was more accurately an A**-Hole")

If I've got a trail that shows I was reasonable with someone, I would've posted it as well. In a heartbeat.

So be warned Monkey: don;t ever send me an email with an expectation of privacy!

[124ADDHE]

You still dont post private stuff like that on a forum!!

I think its abvious that this "Mark" guy was overracting to a solved problem. When I sold real estate, I had these terrible racists in the Jag, was about 60kms from my office, I just could not listen to their garbage anymore, it wasnt woth the 5g's if they did buy a vacation home from me, I just had to, as one must at times, firmly grab my nutsack in my right hand and say "fuk it" and throw them out my car- done, no more arguments with these people, they can badtalk me all they want but, hey, who's going to take the opinion of a couple of wacko-racists, seriosly?

As a business person, you sometimes have to just bite your tongue, the public isnt stupid, people can read between the lines.

[Fiatmonkey]

I'm not complaining about supply and demand at all I do believe you are correct Mark (Allison) that our hobby is waning. But, I simply don't find it appropriate forum decorum to post private emails, and I find it even less appropriate for our vendors to do that. I read the post and feel it could have been handled better if they had said "hey we did do that and we also sent a replacement" no one else needs to read private emails.

The point I'm trying to make is this is not something that needs to become the norm on a forum. That's just my 2 cents, but I can see some people must not be as old as I am. When I came up some things were just not done, and back then it was letters and faxes. Now days with our faster and faster communications its emails and text messages. I don't show anyone at my work what other people send me even if it is just funny, it's just not always appropriate to show other people.

I feel bad for Mark (Allison) because you are left alone to police this forum on your spare time, and while you are still trying to make a living. I understand that some offending people may be your friends now and then, but you have this responsibility. I know some people like to see this kinda stuff as they are the same people that stop and take pictures at car wrecks. I am not one of those people. I want fair and balanced without abuses. Simply put everyone on this forum should be able to say "X" (person or vendor) did this.... And every "X" (person or vendor) should be allowed to simply reply or not. With that each party should stick to the story and we really shouldn't go off kinda-sorta information. But inturn that is upon each of us to be responsible, truthful, and trust worthy adults, and not finger pointing little children.

I applaud Autoricambi for saying, but we did help you. But, I think simply posting "But we sent you a replacement. I'm sorry for any inconvieniences" should have been enough. This should have been enough for the rest of us on this forum to say well ok they fixed it. It's rare to see the ability of any of the vendors to come onto any forum to do that. Maybe, Mark (Allison) you should email all the vendors and offer them all user names to be able to just help better inform all of us. I think this would make things better for all of us on the forum. It would be alot like the old radio law that said if you are going to talk about one side of the topic you must equally talk about the other side of the topic, and for just as long.

Maybe I'm just a cranky old fart, but this just gets under my skin a bit. If Autoricambi is listening thank you for showing us you helped, but next time can you just say so rather than sensationallizing it like the news does. If Mark (Opus) is listening I'm sorry you felt burned, and it's understandable why you were upset. What we can all learn from this is, we should all speak 100% truth. That goes back to a previous post of mine saying when someone asks a question here, give it to them, but without your personal leanings.

We should all be better people and we should all thank all the vendors for doing their jobs. We need to be better people if we ever want our hobby to be as strong as the British cars or the American Muscle. With Fiat back in a America we need to look like a we mantained group of hobbiest to show them that we still care. We don't need to come accross to them as bickering children.

Sorry for my soap box but sometimes, inaction is far to much for me to take.

I will now quietly go back to my Tree Top.

[Fiatmonkey]

P.S. I am just a cranky old man so I'm sorry if I've offended anyone. I will not post anymore on this topic, and full heartedly thank everyone and every vendor. I hope we can all keep the knowledge, love, and enthusiasm alive for our special cars!

[azygoustoyou]

If I've learned one thing it would be, you have no control over others actions. It's so easy to copy and paste.
It would be pretty hard to control one not to post an email.
This forum is a great place we all can learn and share our love for our cars and other social off topic ideas. It's true we all might not get along at times but it's also good to just let things go too.
Now who's buying the first beer?

[maytag]

Now who's buying the first beer?

ME ME! Pick ME!

[So Cal Mark]

somehow I missed that the post contained an email I tend not to read the text that is inserted in boxes in posts, there are only so many hours in the day after all.
I too am surprised when a written conversation I've had with someone is posted, but that seems to be the lack of decorum we can attribute to the internet. This is the age of too-much-information at times

[kmac33]

After reading this thread I had to go back and find the thread in question that triggered it as I had not seen it previously. While I agree that in most instances email, etc should remain private as intended, in this case I have to disagree with your opinion that Csaba/Ramzi at Auto Ricambi stepped over the line. If you disparage a vendor on a public forum, the vendor should have the right to present the facts. And to quote one of your (Monkey's) posts "Simply put everyone on this forum should be able to say "X" (person or vendor) did this.... And every "X" (person or vendor) should be allowed to simply reply or not. With that each party should stick to the story and we really shouldn't go off kinda-sorta information." By posting the email exchange, Auto Ricambi simply presented an unbiased "transcript" of the actual exchange of information that occured, while Opus' post leaned more towards the "kind-sorta information".

[Fiatmonkey]

Kmac, you are abesolutely right, but missed my point entirely. They could have just said "Yes we're sorry, but we supplied you a replacement didn't we?" Leaving it in his court to now say they didn't, which I don't think he would have, as he was just still angry. The point is you can make a point without need to use something private.

It's in the same boat, that I hate seeing news stories using emails and letters that they have "obtained". We just learned from Mr. Murdoch what "obtaining" can trully mean for the news. I know that AR did not illegally obtain anything. I am just pointing out how terrible our news is in the USA.

In short I hope this better explains my point for you Kmac.

Now I will not post about this anymore.

[maytag]

So, nowe that I'm wearing a collar and sitting in the office (I'm pretty sure my previous post was from me wearing my underwear, sitting at home with something cold in-hand ) I'd like to say that I'm still thinking no line was crossed. BUT: I also agree with the last part of Socal Mark's post: the internet has changed the way we comminucate and perhaps blurred where the line is to begin with.

20 years ago, if someone had photo-copied a letter I sent them and then sent copies to a hundred peple I didn't know, I would've expected to be contaacted for permission to do so.
HOWEVER:
As a father, I teach my children to have a healthy amount of concern for what they post on the internet or send in an email. I've told them countless times that "once it's out there, you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube". I've let them know that personal / private items like full-names, addresses, I.D. #'s, etc etc are not to be in ANYTHING they do on the internet without coming to ask me first. I think that reflects my own "policy" in my own internet activities. And the inverse of that is that I assume anything I put on the internet is likley available to ANYONE WHO WANTS TO USE IT IN ANY WAY. This holds no concern for me, nor do I think it is innapropriate; it is simply how things are now.
I think one of the should-be-benefits of this is keeping people more civil in their written communications. Or perhaps in cases like mine, at least more "real".
IE: I don't write it if it's not exactly how I feel, and I am prepared for everyone to see it.